Caitlin Van Mol 0:00 This episode contains descriptions of domestic violence, sexual assault, and assault. Listener discretion is advised

Monique 0:10 when fight or flight kicks in. It is not pain that's felt our brains really protect us. And I didn't know this for a fact. Until it I needed it.

Caitlin Van Mol 0:23 Some of the names in this episode have been changed. Can you tell me a little bit about your early life, how it was growing up? I

Monique 0:31 don't remember my dad ever living in the house, I think because they separated or divorced when I was about two, I remember it being my mom and I. And she worked. And I was in the same small private school, from kindergarten to grade 10 and a half halfway through the first year of high school. In those days, it was just three years of high school. Switching

Caitlin Van Mol 0:56 schools meant meeting a lot of new people, including one boy in particular, named Chris, but

Monique 1:03 I went to the float meeting, and he was there. And I remember, he had on this like satiny outside Yankees jacket, we chatted a little bit and then ran into each other passing and classes. We were both dating other people at the time.

Caitlin Van Mol 1:23 But those relationships ended and Monique and Chris started dating. Chris had no college plans after graduation. But Monique had many opportunities. I was

Monique 1:36 supposed to go to Indiana University. I didn't I turned down the opportunity, which I've regretted for the last 41 years. I stayed locally and started at UCSD University of California, San Diego. And that was in close proximity to him. And so he could be up at my dorm all the time.

Caitlin Van Mol 1:57 Then one thing led to another. And how did you find out you're pregnant?

Monique 2:02 My regular monthly cycle was like to the day you could set your calendar to it. And I just knew in my heart that I could do it that I could have this child. I don't know why at 18. That was a driving force for me. But it was

Caitlin Van Mol 2:20 how did Chris take the news? He seemed okay.

Monique 2:23 But I don't recall him being angry or upset. He was probably shocked. I just told him that that's I wanted to have this baby. And I felt like I could do it with or without him. Monique

Caitlin Van Mol 2:35 and Chris told their parents, which didn't go great.

Monique 2:39 I recall that Chris's mom said in an angry voice. She's trying to trap him. And my mom immediately responded, trap what exactly he has no education, no money, what is she trapping, and then the gloves were off between the parents and you know, the screaming and yelling my dad brought it back down to a calm nature. And he said, Well, here's what it is. You don't have any money or education Monique hasn't finished hers and has no money. So you should join the military.

Caitlin Van Mol 3:12 So Chris joined the Navy and Monique started work as a phlebotomist in a hospital lab. They got married right before their daughter Ashley was born. But even with two incomes, it was barely enough to get by. The young family of three lived in an extra apartment Chris's dad had rented. But the help from the grandparents ended

Monique 3:35 there. My mom had physically attacked Chris before he went to boot camp. And because she wanted an apology that I was pregnant, and he refused. And so she physically attacked him a little bit unpredictable. My mom, and understandably, he did not want her at the apartment. And so therefore, I said, if she can't be at the apartment to help, then your mom is not coming. So but he had to be at work every day. So I did it on my own. I figured it out. Once I recovered from childbirth, then I was still working in the hospital and I tried to work the night shift, which was horrible. I am not a nighttime person. I'm a morning person and I cannot stay up all night long. It was terrible.

Caitlin Van Mol 4:23 And then go home to take care of a baby all day. Right?

Monique 4:27 Exactly. I could nap you know, my thought in my thought process. It was all nap when she naps and but um, even if she was napping as a newborn, I was still sleepy and then I'd start to panic before I had to go to work the next night. And it was terrible for me. They just have to get off the night shift but we were trying to avoid childcare which we could not afford. So I still have our original tax return as a married couple. And we made $9,000 that year.

Caitlin Van Mol 4:59 You $9,000 in 1984 is equivalent to a little more than $27,000. Today, being young, financially insecure with an infant and no help put stress on their already fraught relationship. When did things start getting bad?

Monique 5:20 I would say in the first six months of our marriage after Ashley was born, I mean, it was pretty immediate. I always saw it as we both were young, strong personalities. I am not a wilting flower. I'm not today, I picked my battles better today. But we, we never got along. We always were like oil and water. Even in high school. We argued about the color of the sky.

Caitlin Van Mol 5:49 But Monique clung to the idea of a two parent household. She and Chris had two more children, Elise, who she conceived while on birth control. And Nicholas, who was planned because Monique wanted a boy. At this point, Chris and Monique had been married for 10 years, and we're living in Jacksonville, Florida. When did you start putting a plan in motion to leave?

Monique 6:15 The first time he was very physical, where we had an argument about money. We were always arguing about bills, we could never pay our bills on time. You know, I was determined to feed the kids. And, you know, our finances were just always a mess. And so I remember distinctly he came home from work that day,

Caitlin Van Mol 6:36 they were behind on their car payment. And the lender had called Chris's commander to encourage him to pay, which really set Chris off

Monique 6:45 and he was embarrassed and he was angry. And I said something that set him off probably sarcastic that he didn't appreciate. And he I remember him throwing me down on the ground and starting to strangle me. And that was the moment after the panic and the calm that when I stood up that that was it for me that I'm leaving, I had no money to leave, but I was leaving with my three children. I remembered saying okay, I'm going to file my tax return because when you have no money, you usually get a large tax return, and I was going to figure out a way.

Caitlin Van Mol 7:24 Monique's father was American Football League All Star Earl phase on. While very active as a coach and educator in his post football career. He was not a present father for Monique. My

Monique 7:37 dad was not someone who helped a lot. He didn't pay any child support. While I was growing up in high school, I took a I think it was law for living class. But I learned in that class that parents can be sued for back child support. So I called him and told him that I was going to sue him for back child support on behalf of my mom. And that got him to start paying me. I want to say $120 a month. He just was never the type to help people when they needed it. It's

Caitlin Van Mol 8:15 just the one person who could have thrown you a life preserver was best resourced? Yes.

Monique 8:21 100%. He absolutely was. But he would have never said yes. And I refuse to give him the opportunity. And you know, people may say, but you didn't give him the opportunity. I asked him enough times, to know Him. And to know he was not going to help.

Caitlin Van Mol 8:39 But if you had a different financial situation, do you think you would have left him sooner? Oh,

Monique 8:47 probably. So, um, but also, I, you know, for years for decades, I believe that it's better for kids to have two parents and that is just not correct. It's better for kids to have a strong, healthy, loving, unconditionally loving parent, grandparent, aunt, uncle, whoever is raising the children. It's better for them to have one. If it can be two, that's beautiful, but to parents, where it's a very unhealthy, hostile, toxic environment is not good for them. But I believe that incorrectly for decades,

Caitlin Van Mol 9:28 though it was months away. Monique told Chris that she was leaving once she got her tax return. And things went from bad to worse. I

Monique 9:38 remember distinctly we had an argument as we always did, and I remember where I was I was walking away from him. And he said, Don't forget, OJ got away with it. I really believe that. You know, we have angels and loved ones who are deceased who are looking out for us and send us messages And it's like somebody punched me in the gut and said, pay attention. He means it. But but because I always had some response, some retort, I said, and don't you forget? OJ had money, and you do not. Monique

Caitlin Van Mol 10:17 finally moved out with the kids. And she was extremely relieved to be rid of the threat of His presence. Initially,

Monique 10:24 I was so thrilled, I cannot even describe how thrilled I was not to be in the same house with him. I was thrilled to be in my own place with the kids. That's all I wanted was PCE. And he made promises, oh, I'll help. I'll start child support. All these things never came through. I continued to struggle couldn't make ends meet, which now I realized was all part of the plan. But he was calm. I remember filing for divorce so I could get child support right away. He talked me out of that. The reason he gave me was that he was up for a big promotion. And he'd be able to pay me more. Now, you know, once you're out of a situation, things are always much more clear. And so I realized that, if that was the case, I still should have kept the paperwork there. And then taking him back to court to get more money when he got the promotion. That court costs money. Yes. And time away from work. Yeah. So as as the six months went by. He talked about people who was dating, I was encouraging him like, Oh, this is great. That's wonderful, all of those things. And then he had all three kids first time in six months. And my co worker asked me out for that night. So it was the perfect situation. So of course, I said, Yes,

Caitlin Van Mol 11:49 Chris had talked about dating. So Monique didn't think it would be a problem to tell him that she had been on a date. But

Monique 11:57 that day, that conversation set in motion, what would change our lives all of our lives forever.

Caitlin Van Mol 12:06 The evening after that phone call. Chris went to the hospital, where Monique and her date, who were calling Barrington both worked,

Monique 12:16 how he figured out who he was, I'm not sure maybe I mentioned his name, I don't know. But he confronted him that night. And then the stalking began for three solid months after that. It was bizarre.

Caitlin Van Mol 12:30 What kind of like stalking activity did he do?

Monique 12:34 The suit, the stalking looked like he circled my apartment, it was like a, you know, you come into the apartment complex in there. You know, each cluster of apartments had like a little cul de sac thing. And he made that circle almost every 45 minutes around the clock. He was not sleeping, nor was he working. He would come out of the bushes and you know be lurking around. I remember my boyfriend and I were talking outside on the stairs, literally talking. And he popped around the corner with a video camera. Remember, when video cameras were big back then, you know, you carry them on your shoulders. And he said I caught you. Okay, you caught us doing what talking? Like he just really it was everywhere. We went to be

Caitlin Van Mol 13:31 constantly on guard. It's constant. There's no brainer. Yeah, I get. You're always up here. You're Yes, allowed to like, relax into a moment.

Monique 13:43 Right? So when I left work, he would be somewhere at a distance in the parking lot. When I took the kids to school. I always saw him in my rearview mirror, either on foot or in the car. It was three months of constant stalking. The only bit of peace was when he was arrested until his parents made bond. When

Caitlin Van Mol 14:10 he had been granted a protective order that prohibited Chris from contacting her or being on the premises of her home or work. All of this behavior was in violation of that order.

Monique 14:23 I think the first time he was arrested, maybe he was in there 24 hours or 48 hours. And then it was so peaceful. It was so such a piece because he was taken out of the picture. And each time he may have been arrested three times total maybe before the end, but um, we'd have to appear in court. And he would always be extremely respectful. Yes, Your Honor. I understand your honor. The judge kept getting more and more angry and remember judge Ruth got more and more angry at him each court appearance and he leave court and pick up right where he left off.

Caitlin Van Mol 15:01 He also took Monique's car, which was in his name, she then bought her own, which made him furious. And then he came for her job.

Monique 15:10 I was working somewhere in Jacksonville, the JCA. At the time,

Caitlin Van Mol 15:15 the Jewish Community Alliance,

Monique 15:18 I don't know what the conversation was. But he got to my manager, and she told me, she had to let me go for fear of workplace violence. And she said, Monique, I'm so sorry to do this. But for the fear, I mean, for the protection of other employees and people in the building. We have to let you go, and we'll hire you right back when all of this mess is cleared up.

Caitlin Van Mol 15:47 It was no secret that the most important things in the world to Monique were her children. So Chris tried to turn Ashley, their oldest child against her.

Monique 15:59 He was working on Ashley constantly to turn her against me that your mom's doing these things. And it's unhealthy for you guys. And she's wrong. And she's cheating. And it's, um, it's adultery. And I mean, he tried everything.

Caitlin Van Mol 16:18 Monique was at her wit's end. But then, October

Monique 16:22 27 1997, that's when everything happened.

Caitlin Van Mol 16:26 That morning, she was trying to get her kids in the car to take them to school.

Monique 16:30 I'm walking to the, the kids to the car, they're slightly behind me. And I was around the passenger side. But I remember unlocking the door and glancing up, and I could see him running from the bushes behind my building, with a gun in front of him, straight at me. And I always felt like people think that they know what they'll do when they're faced with danger. I can promise you, nobody knows. Until you're in that life threatening position. No one knows we all think that we'll plan we all think will react this way. I could not will my body to move I was in such shock. And fear. I was frozen. He got to us so fast. And started hitting me trying to get me to get in the car and was screaming at the kids to get in the car. And but remember, I'm on the passenger side. And I had taken a safety class. And I remembered one lesson that they said never be taken from point A to point B. If someone's going to shoot and kill you or kill you let them do it right there where you can get help. So I'm fighting to stay out of the car. He's fighting to get me in the car. But I'm at any moment, thinking he's gonna blow my brains out any moment. Eventually he picks me up. I was much smaller than puts me in the passenger side gets in next to me, closes the door, climbs over me. Turns on the car, backs it out. I thought the kids were behind me. I said, Oh my god, the kids thought he hit the kids. I was so fearful. And he said they

Caitlin Van Mol 18:21 left. Elise and Nick had run away when Chris started attacking Monique. And all she could do was hope they were okay. While Chris drove off.

Monique 18:32 So he's racing off like a bat out of hell. He's driving like a maniac. Through intersections through parking lots skidding, I can see I put on my seatbelt because I don't want us to crash and I'm thrown from the car or killed that way. I see sparks flying. Chris

Caitlin Van Mol 18:53 had popped a tire and was driving on the rim. I

Monique 18:57 remember he assumed as we were driving straight before pulling off to change the tire. He elbowed me in the cheek and punched me in the mouth and said that's for all the devastation you you caused Ashley because remember, he's manipulating her and getting her to think that you know, I'm the bad guy here. I'm the one in the wrong because of the flat tire. He pulls us behind this building. I think it was a gas station. So I'm crying and my nose is stuffed and he starts to put duct tape on my mouth and I can't breathe through my nose. So I said please don't. I can't breathe. And he didn't. But he duct taped me to the gearshift once we pulled around that building so that he could change the tire.

Caitlin Van Mol 19:45 He changed the tire and got back on the road.

Monique 19:48 So we're back driving on the road. And I'm thinking at any moment, there's going to be sirens there's going to be people are looking for us. He's saying I just want to talk to you. Um let you go, I just want to talk to you. But what's hard to realize sometimes is that this is someone that even though he connects me, even though he stalked me for three months, I could not take that leap. I could not envision that there was true danger. I just thought he was out of control. He's an angry out of control person. Then

Caitlin Van Mol 20:22 her oil light came on, and then cars buttered to a stop. They walked to a store to get oil. And Monique kept begging him to let her go get the kids.

Monique 20:34 And I said can I please call back my friend Beth, to get the kids because you know, when the police are looking for him, both parents are not around. The police could take them to Child Protective Services. You know, there's three minors now. Ashley was at his apartment, who he allowed to stay out of school that day, which was so common for him. And then Elise and Nick were somewhere I didn't know where they went. me thinking that I'm going to convince him to turn himself in. But this is going to be over soon. I'm gonna go to my children. I said to him, You haven't done anything at this point. That's so bad, that it can't be fixed.

Caitlin Van Mol 21:12 Shockingly, Chris walked with Monique to a grocery store. So she could call Beth.

Monique 21:18 It was a crowded morning, grocery shopping time. I could have gotten away. But I'm convinced that he's going to let me go, that I'm going to help him turn himself in. I call Beth. And I remember distinctly her saying, Monique, where are you? And I said, He's standing right next to me. I can't tell you that, but I'll be home soon. She said I have all three kids and we have police protection. So I I was so relieved to hear that that they were in her care and protection. She said please tell me where you are. And I said it's okay. I'll be I'll be home soon. He just wants to talk to me. I stupidly walk back to the car with him. So what I didn't realize and truly saved my life is that the oil drip pan apparently is at the bottom of the car. He got scraped and hole when he was you know, going over curbs and dashing to get me away. It all the oil drained out and locked up.

Caitlin Van Mol 22:25 So when Chris put new oil in the car, it only lasted a few blocks before breaking down again.

Monique 22:31 So the car kind of rolled into what you know, when it's locking up, it rolled into this new subdivision being built. There was a model home and there was, you know, houses that had been built. But nobody was living in them yet. So nobody was around because it's drizzly and construction workers don't work, typically in the rain. So we're sitting there talking, he's asking me questions about what Barrington had, compared to him, like, like just unrealistic questions.

Caitlin Van Mol 23:05 Then he raped her.

Monique 23:09 And I just was disgusted. You know, once you turn that page, and you're done, you're done. And I said, What's the purpose? What are you doing? I think he thought in some screwed up way that by being with me in that way that maybe I want to go back to him. I don't know, I'm that's just grasp. I have no idea. And I remember him saying you must really hate me. And I thought I just want to go home to my kids. I just want to divorce. I just want to move on with my life. Like the simple things in life. I remember him saying I'm gonna go in that house over there and see if there's anyone to help us. Which, you know, after everything happened, that didn't even make sense, but at the time, it seemed reasonable. Yeah, he was trying to see if somebody could help us with the car.

Caitlin Van Mol 24:05 While Chris was looking through the empty house, Monique had a chance to look around the car. He

Monique 24:12 bought long strip ties, you know, there's one way locking strip tie things. So I remember when he walked over to the other house, and it's still raining enough that there's water running along the side of the road. And there was a what he called them in the street, the the sewer drain. And I quietly opened the car and put all those strip ties down next to the door and they washed into the drain. She

Caitlin Van Mol 24:39 quietly shut the door. Chris came back having found no help for the car.

Monique 24:45 Finally, it must have been about six hours. He had a bracelet and he took off his bracelet and he said oh, I'll go now you can you can go with me to the police and he said But can we look at this house over here first and So, finally, something hits me unsteady. I'm like, that seems strange in my head. But I'm thinking, then I'm trying to justify it in my head. Well, maybe he's, you know, fantasizing about when we were planning to buy a house. I'm trying to justify rationally what it can mean. But the red flags are finally booming in my ear. But Chris has

Caitlin Van Mol 25:25 also agreed to go to the police right after looking at the house. So if she can just get through this, it will all be over. He

Monique 25:35 opens the door. Remember, he went to the house before. So he already knows what's in the house. And so I kept my distance from him. Like, I don't know how many feet because I remember that when I finally got to the front door, and I'm looking at the house at a distance inside. He walks down the hall that straight to the garage. And so he said, See, you can get out here, you can get out through the garage. So I cautiously walked down the hallway to the garage. The house had been built and newly landscaped. There's tall garden tools in the garage that the landscapers must have left, he moves the shovel out of the group. And I said, Why did you do that. And at that moment, I knew and I turned to run, and it was too late. And that first blow to my head, knocked me to the ground, blood splattered all over that brand new white garage. And I remember being in shock. And I think that he saw that it was going to be messy. So he picked me up with one arm holding the shovel and carried me across the street on the side where the car was. And but it was heavily wooded area there. And I'm begging him as he's carrying me across the street, please, please don't do this. Please let me go. Please don't do this. And I don't think he said anything. I don't recall. But I remember him throwing me down. I was face down. And I had my hands over my head. And he means hitting my hands and my head. But my hands. My fingers were broken. But my my hands were saving my head.

Caitlin Van Mol 27:26 Monique was wearing a ring that was smashed all the way down to the bone. Chris paused, getting her with a shovel to ask,

Monique 27:35 can you hear me? So he's standing up? I'm laying face down? And he said, Can you hear me? I didn't answer but I could hear him. He checked my pulse, which was still going clearly and probably booming. I felt like my pulse was so loud and strong. And I remember him lifting my eye saying can you I tried to stare straight? Can you hear me? I didn't answer but I could hear him. And he walked around the front of my head. So I'm laying face down. And he took his foot and moved my hands out of the way. So he had a clear shot of my head and continued hitting me hitting my head. And I remember someone a friend saying How did you stay still knowing that that shovel was coming towards your head? I don't know. I can't even answer that. So I laid there and I laid still, I remember him leaning over me he must have been looking at my messy head. And I heard him walk away. I heard him throw the shovel. But I didn't know if he was sitting at a distance waiting to watch me. So I couldn't move. I was afraid to move. And I must have laid there the detective said about 45 minutes or so because I remember waking up shivering.

Caitlin Van Mol 28:55 If Chris was still watching her, she knew that her shivering would reveal that she was still alive because dead people

Monique 29:04 don't shiver. So I thought I have no choice whether he's watching or not. I have no choice. So now the pressure from the blows to my head. I could barely see like my eyes were swollen, almost completely shut. And I remember slightly lifting my head and I saw an old station wagon with an older man sitting in it drinking his coffee. And I thought I have to make it to him. So I'm half clothed because of the forced sexual assault. My head I don't even know what it looked like it must have been a mess. And I stagger out of the heavily wooded area and I collapsed in the street. He races out of the car and sent stay right there. Not that I was going anywhere but say right there. I'll go get you help. I'll come right back. And I was so fearful for him to leave Give me this complete stranger, I stood up and I said, I said, Please don't leave me and I moved my body to his passenger side. And he opened the door and I collapsed in the passenger seat,

Caitlin Van Mol 30:13 the man drove her to the model home from the new subdivision and ran inside, he came out with two other people, one of which was on the phone with 911.

Monique 30:23 So the ambulance came, and they also called lifeflight. And I remember being in the helicopter, and this is the lesson that any medical professional should know is you don't talk out loud about the patient within. So they probably thought that I was out. But I could hear them say, and one said to the other, is that gray matter in her ear. And so I'm thinking in my head, I'm going to die in this helicopter. So what's going through my head when I was rescued was fear, not

Caitlin Van Mol 30:58 just fear that she was going to die from her current injuries. But fear Chris would find her and finish what he started.

Monique 31:07 I know if you had anybody had called the hospital. At that time, they would have been told I was not a patient because they didn't know at that time where he was right and they didn't want him coming to the hospital. But that was my fear. Like it's hard to even explain the tremendous fear. Even though I had an armed guard outside my room. And I could see him. I remember waking up from the heavy medication at one point and not seeing him there and being panicked. Beyond

Caitlin Van Mol 31:38 the fear. Monique just wanted to see her kids who she was told were okay.

Monique 31:44 What I found out later, because I was so fearful that the kids were behind the car is that the neighbor's next to me, who knew that he was stalking me full time and all of the things. She was on the phone calling the police. We all have huge big picture windows. So their teenage daughter saw everything happened through their window. And so she screams to her parents. Her dad worked the night shift. So he was trying to get up to come help me. The mom is on the phone calling the police. The teenage daughter flings open their window and she screams to the kids come to me. Don't listen to him come to me.

Caitlin Van Mol 32:23 When he also found out the gun Chris threatened her with was fake.

Monique 32:28 If that had been a real gun, he could have turned and shot her. So without fear of her own safety. She immediately called to them to come come to her and to you know, rescue them and thank God she did that because what would he have done with them? I can't even imagine like what was the plan? Yeah. But she screamed to them. Don't listen, don't listen to him. Just come to me. And and they did. Elise went and Nick followed. So I'm just grateful every day that she did that.

Caitlin Van Mol 33:01 Elisa neck were too young to visit Monique in the hospital. But Ashley was allowed to come and see her mother. What was it like seeing Ashley for the first time? It was

Monique 33:14 so upsetting for her? I I wanted her to jump in and be the great big sister that she is still today. And I said it's okay. You know, I kept reassuring her I said it's okay, I'm okay. Everything's gonna be okay. And I think for her, you know, she was young, I think she was 12 at the time. And so she saw immediately the manipulations in the lack of truth that her father the lies, the things he had made up and the things that that he had done, and she, you know, deals with that guilt. But, you know, I reassured her you know, months later that it is not your fault. He's he was the adult. He was manipulating you are the child. It was never your fault. I forgive you for every single thing not even a question don't don't allow yourself to be tormented with guilt.

Caitlin Van Mol 34:11 While Monique was in the hospital, Chris was still at large. Police were sneaking out his apartment, but he managed to slip inside and grab a butcher's knife and slip out again. Around 3am Chris was spotted walking in the area by a police officer. Unfortunately crase also spotted the police officer and ran into a water tunnel off the road. The officer called for backup and when it arrived, they called for Chris to come out of the tunnel with his hands up. Instead, Chris came out and ran at the officer with a knife held up high. The officer shot and hit crest three times in the foot, the chest on the lower ribs. As they loaded Chris into the ambulance. They He noticed he had tried to cut his wrists and into his throat with a knife. He was then taken to the same hospital where Monique was being treated. Monique and Chris being in the same hospital, meant their families were also in the same hospital.

Monique 35:16 It was a nightmare for the hospital staff. They couldn't handle the media they couldn't handle are two sides of the family, which were now in the same area of the hospital and ready to kill each other. Like everybody's angry. And I didn't realize how bad I looked. Yeah, I mean, it was completely bandaged, like I was really not recognizable, which is why my favorite relative of all time, my uncle Rodney, when he saw me and did not recognize me in the hospital, they had to remove him because he was going to find Chris and finish the job himself. He was beside himself. And he was always my protector. I miss him terribly, my uncle crazy. But sweetheart of a man.

Caitlin Van Mol 36:04 Meanwhile, Chris didn't let his life threatening injuries stand in the way of trying to spin what happened so that he was the victim. He

Monique 36:14 told the police guarding him that I hit him with the shovel. He hit me back, and he ran off. And it wasn't rape. We were just fooling around in the car. My fingerprints weren't on that shovel. I never had the chance. I never saw it coming. Well, how

Caitlin Van Mol 36:33 did those other wounds happen? If you if you only hit you once. But

Monique 36:39 see, remember, he doesn't know what kind of shape I'm in. He doesn't know if I'm alive or not at this point. That's what he told the police. That's what he told his parents. I remember as they were building the case against him. I remember his parents being devastated that the prosecutor was looking at 30 years they wanted to go for. And I remember them calling me harassing me, begging me not to pursue 30 years and I wasn't pursuing 30 years it was the prosecutor's office, the state of Florida was prosecuting him this violent criminal who was clearly a danger to police and a danger to me and our children. I remember distinctly his mom saying, Oh, he wasn't trying to kill you. And I said, Well, what was he doing with the shovel to my head then? And she said he was trying to prevent you from getting him to turn himself in, like he didn't want to do? And I said, so he had to hit me multiple times in the head with a shovel to say no, I don't want to turn myself in. And so she said, Yes. He wasn't trying to kill you. And I said, Oh, then what? Did he bring the large kitchen butcher knife for? You kidnap me? Oh, I don't know if that's too horrible to think about. She said. I said you're right. It is too horrible. And I think about it every day. What that would have been like, if he had used that tool that he had brought. They weren't worried about me. They were worried about their son if he was going to die, trying to keep him out of looking at 30 years when he was finally out of prison. So he was very messed up by the bullets. But they did not. Unfortunately, take his life. So

Caitlin Van Mol 38:20 did I don't know how to ask this. But other than like, you can just ask it. Yeah. Did you want him to die?

Monique 38:30 Absolutely. 100% I did. Life would have been so much easier. And I can't even say that it wouldn't be easier today. I absolutely would lose no sleep if he were to fall off somewhere. It's something that looms over all of us. And it's unfortunate, it would have been easier if he were dead. And I absolutely hoped that he would die. But that didn't happen. The families

Caitlin Van Mol 39:03 were getting to be too much trouble for the hospital. And since Monique was in good enough shape. They discharged her after only a few days. Where did you go after the hospital?

Monique 39:14 I went home to get back to my apartment. My mom, my uncle were there. The community rallied around us. We were getting meals. I again, I never looked at myself in the mirror. I didn't realize how I looked when I first got home that brought the kids home and the girls came right away. But Nick wouldn't approach me because he didn't recognize me. I had to say to him, Nick, it's it's me. Once he heard my voice eventually I coaxed him over but he was fearful. You know, I was wrapped like a mummy. And it was it was not something kids should

Caitlin Van Mol 39:52 see. How much use did you have of your hands? I

Monique 39:55 didn't until I could. I was in these like I don't know what you want to call them, like this semi caste type thing. But so I could use them like this to drive. I took the kids once to school and a friend at the time she she called me and said, Monique, can I take the kids for you? No one's ready to see you. And even though I didn't have, like bandages, I didn't realize that, where I had stitches and staples, that it didn't look good back there. My eyes were still purple. And I guess a lot people off guard. And so she volunteered and said, Can I do this for you? In other words, you're scaring people do not walk, walk in public like this.

Caitlin Van Mol 40:48 Monique was an active member in the local Jewish community. And they brought her family meals and groceries. But they also went above and beyond the basics. You got a therapist pretty quickly after that, after this happened. Tell me about that decision and the process of finding someone. I didn't

Monique 41:09 even do it myself. The community had the Jewish community right away from Jewish Family Services, assigned a therapist to me and Ashley and one to Nick and Elise, in preparation for what we what they thought would be a trial. Should he survive? I mean, they there were so many things that were put in place for us that I never had to ask for. That just everyone was there to support me and the kids and help. So we I didn't even have the ability at that time to think about the next step is, you know, therapy we need. There was already one assigned to us.

Caitlin Van Mol 41:50 I mean, how were the kids handling this, the aftermath of all of this?

Monique 41:56 Yeah. You know, there's a sudden loss of a parent that is not dead, but is unaccessible to them, unable to see and visit with them. And suddenly, that person's gone, like out of their lives but not dead. I'm sure that it left them in some Limbo trying to work through why he did this. Luckily,

Caitlin Van Mol 42:24 for Monique and her children, Chris ended up taking a plea bargain. So there was no trial. He was sentenced to 26 years a great relief to Monique. But then

Monique 42:36 the oddest thing a few years into things after I had moved my kids to Connecticut, from Florida, something no one told me anything but some weird gut feeling. I started paying attention to my gut after this incident, by the way, I had this weird feeling about Chris. And I was fearful that he had broken out of prison or, and I'm a news person, I'm obsessed with the news. So I would have seen that. But logic doesn't take over when fear. You know, it's hard to be logical and your full place. So I called the prison. And they look him up. And I just needed reassurance that everything was okay. And they said, Hold on, ma'am. I'm going to transfer you to the release department.

Caitlin Van Mol 43:25 Hearing she was being transferred to the release department. Completely horrified, Monique. I

Monique 43:32 could not form a sentence by the time they picked up the phone. By the time that transfer happened. I was so overcome with emotion, and crying sobbing. I couldn't speak a sentence. I went into extreme panic. And so the woman on the phone said, It's okay. Take your time. I'll wait till you're ready to talk. And finally I could get it out. Like, where is he? Like, why did they transfer me to the release? What it was, is he was in court. And anytime someone leaves the prison for any reason to appear in court, will go to the hospital whatever it is there. It's considered a release but it's technically not a release from prison. But I didn't know that. How would I know that?

Caitlin Van Mol 44:22 The woman on the phone couldn't tell her why Chris was in court. So Monique sobbing crying, called The court found no help there. And finally tried to find David Barksdale.

Monique 44:35 David Barksdale was the past prosecutor. In my case, I'm asking for him. He no longer works there. So I keep calling people at the courthouse to try and figure out what is going on.

Caitlin Van Mol 44:46 She eventually tracked down David's number, so

Monique 44:48 I called him I have it a little better together. And he said, Monique, I'm so glad you called.

Caitlin Van Mol 44:55 Though he pled guilty. Chris was now asking a judge for a trial. Okay,

Monique 45:00 so David Barksdale had been consulted by the new prosecuting attorney in the DHS office about the case. And they were in the process of talking about it. That was my gut feeling. So David and I went back and forth over a few weeks. And he said, Monique, you never want to try a case in front of a jury, if you can avoid it. Juries are unpredictable, as we see in the news all the time, you never know what things will go. And when there's a plea bargain, the evidence is usually gotten rid of. So they may not even have had the shovel, any of the DNA testing anything that happened. So with his public defender, he was willing to offer 20 years in lieu of the new trial. And so I was outraged, because I felt like you're not in a position to ask for reduction in time, you're not in a position to ask for anything, you have no rights, that you lost those rights when you made the choices. He did on that day, October 27. So I was outraged that I was in this position. But actually it also was in college, at least was on her way. And I, you know, I just wanted them to live normal lives not have to fly down to Florida, be called as a witness as their father. And so I agreed to 20 years. And he had to serve 80% of that, which reduced it to 16 years. So do I think that it was enough time? No. But he's a marked sex, sexual predator for the rest of his life. And so that's got to be its own Hell, no matter where you go, that David said, my goal is to get Nicholas who was the youngest out of high school and into adulthood, but not to be a minor, where he could attempt to get some sort of custody. And shockingly, he did not lose his parental rights in trying to kill me. I know, it's bizarre, it's hard to understand. And he did not directly emotionally he impacted the kids terribly. And that should go against a parent to emotional abuse is just as impactful and dangerous as physical abuse. Yeah,

Caitlin Van Mol 47:27 he like wielded a knife against you with the kids present. Yes.

Monique 47:32 But he did not lose his parental rights. I know. Shocking.

Caitlin Van Mol 47:40 With Chris behind bars, it was finally time to move on. Monique and Barrington got married and adopted a girl named Lillian. How quickly did you get married?

Monique 47:52 Oh, very fast after because I don't believe in living together with children, which I think in retrospect, too, was just old fashion. He was committed. He was committed to me and he was committed to the kids. Would I make a different decision today? 100%. But we should have just live separately. And seeing if under not under duress, as we had had our whole relationship. We would still be interested in being married and I'm sure the answer would have been no. I think the reality though, he was just too young. The reality of raising children is difficult. And it just you know, and again, we didn't have the money we needed and you know, so yeah,

Caitlin Van Mol 48:36 so the financial issues are still there. Raising kids is hard. But also he

Monique 48:42 started to cheat. And the first time he cheated. I was devastated, completely devastated, broadsided. I used to pray that Chris would cheat that some woman would come along and he went off into the sunset with her. When it happened with Barrington I was completely broadsided completely caught off guard. Although a marriage therapist I remember her saying no one's caught that completely off guard. You must have seen it coming. I really didn't. What I learned from that relationship is I am not the person that can move forward pass a cheating incident. I'm not I can't. And so no matter how many books you read, and how many, you know, logically, you think you can work together and Some couples come out stronger on the other end. That is fantastic. That is not me. Yeah, I'm off to walk away because I just am not forgiving in that way. So it ended after the second affair. I was done. You know I kind of blame myself for that marriage one I should have never married. I didn't need a second parent. I just needed myself for all of us to heal. Then

Caitlin Van Mol 49:50 Chris was released in 2014.

Monique 49:53 It was panic, panic everywhere.

Caitlin Van Mol 49:56 Is that lasting

Monique 50:00 Panic, oh, trauma never leaves us, never leaves us, there are moments that people don't even realize what's happening in my head that I worry about some things that are, you know, disturbing thoughts. And often what they are is that someone's going to try and kill me push me off something or try and kill me. It's not him. It's just someone. But when he was getting out, I started seeing a PTSD therapist, who is just fantastic. She had worked with 911. Survivors, I think she worked with some of the Sandy Hook families, I also started EMDR training during the height of the pandemic, and they need to pick that back up. And so it would be helpful to have some coping mechanisms. But that's when I started, when he was about to get out. It's just scary. Like, you know, we have alarms and cameras, and I've had that for decades, and dog, a dog and all of those things. And it's never enough. There's never enough security. The one thing the prosecutor in my case would not allow is for him to get rid of, during the plea, there's all sorts of negotiations that go on, he would not allow him to drop the sexual assault part of the plea bargain, because he always wanted me to be able to track him, which was very wise, in his in retrospect. So because I do track him and keep up with where he might be living. I

Caitlin Van Mol 51:31 mean, given all of this, how do you deal with anger, just not letting that takeover?

Monique 51:40 No, I mean, it sounds very cliche that no one's guaranteed, you know, the next day, but we really are not, you know, life can change on a dime, and accident, anything. And it's truly, really important that those that we love, know that we love them. And that will always be with them. And so that's how I don't get self absorbed. I'm still trying to learn and grow and enjoy my life and work and be a productive citizen in the world. We do have this looming, gray cloud, though, over us from my first ex husband, I don't think he would pursue me again, after his freedom because I have a lifetime injunction for protection, he could go immediately back to prison. He could not contact me directly or through another party. But the kids don't want anything to do with him. In

Caitlin Van Mol 52:36 2012, Monique got married again, and is happily wed to a woman named Leah. How did you meet Leah?

Monique 52:44 So Leah and I work together. And I had an incredible relationship with the first woman in my life, who for sure was the love of my life of all relationships. She introduced me to women, but who did I take my my questions to? Because some things are just not obvious. But my, my lesbian coworker, Leah. So I took some questions to her. We were close friends enough to ask her some questions. And we develop this friendship and we're friends and then, you know, became more and got married.

Caitlin Van Mol 53:24 What happened to the other woman?

Monique 53:25 Oh, no, we broke up. And that was devastating. Devastating for a variety of reasons. I just won't go into the details of why that didn't last but but definitely the love of my life. And having experienced that I am satisfied for the rest of my life that I had this exceptional time. 26 months with this person. And I love my wife. I'm sure she has another love of her life. But you know, we can have we can be married to someone else and recognize that that once in a lifetime experience was a gift truly a gift.

Caitlin Van Mol 54:08 How does Leo feel about you calling another woman fill up or like another person a love of your life?

Monique 54:16 I think she accepts in I think she understands that. I'm sure that someone else she calls someone else the love of her life too. Because we love each other. We're committed to each other. And so it doesn't. It doesn't take away from our relationship. I think I think there's an unrealistic expectation that the relationship that you're in has to be the one of your lifetime. And it's just not. It's a good marriage. We're committed. My children have grown to love her over the years and my grandchildren absolutely adore her. And so I think she accepts it for the way that it is. I know that I'm not the love of her life and I'm okay with that. Obviously

Caitlin Van Mol 54:58 more Nake has lived a very interesting life. So her friends convinced her to write a book. And 2019 She published her memoir, playing dead, a memoir of terror and survival. So

Monique 55:14 I tried by myself at first. And I was like writing it like a police report. You know, this is this, you know. And eventually, after about four years, I hired a professional co writer, Gary Krebs, he has over 30 years of publishing experience, so he knows what should stay and which not. The day it was published. I felt like I was going to have a heart attack like, this is so private and personal to me and the kids really about the kids. I really wanted to protect them. They supported me in writing it, but you know, I worry, there's this embarrassing thing that happened. And will people judge them for it? And yeah, yeah, how

Caitlin Van Mol 55:56 did it specifically Ashley, handle it?

Monique 56:00 She like Nick and Elise were supportive. But I think there's always a sense of, you know, discomfort. This was their father. Like, it's one of those things. It's like the skeleton in the closet. I really worry about Nick as a as a man, he's 31. Now that someone's going to judge him one day or think he's like his father, and thankfully, He's nothing like him. He, he's a warm, loving person. I worry that you know, some future in law family is going to judge him for the sins of His Father. So hopefully,

Caitlin Van Mol 56:38 before they learn the story, they'll already know him quite well. Yeah, she'd be able to not do that.

Monique 56:47 Yeah, I hope so too. The lessons from the story is for people to follow their gut. Really important. Don't be embarrassed. Like, if you feel uncomfortable, and you turn around from a situation, don't be embarrassed that your gut is giving you something act on it, it's okay, if you're wrong, best to follow your gut. People need to realize things can change that people are not always what they seem, you know, at signs of danger, save yourself, and or your children, of course, but I had a couple of times where I could have gotten away and I didn't because I wasn't aware, you know, at least be aware of what domestic violence looks like. I thought that domestic violence was you know, broken bones and black eyes and that type of thing. But our relationship, though toxic, and hostile, was not violent until the end. And so that's what I think is really important. Did he have the potential 100%? He absolutely did. But I didn't realize it at the time. I didn't realize that was in danger. And also just to be cautious in a breakup any breakup man or woman. Woman can be dangerous too, just like he was and just be cautious.

Caitlin Van Mol 58:16 If you or someone you know would like information and resources for survivors of domestic violence, you can visit the hotline.org or call one 800 799 safe or 1-800-799-7233 or text 88788 This is live to tell. I'm Caitlin van mol. You can follow the show on Instagram and Tiktok at live to tell podcast. If you enjoy today's episode, please rate review and subscribe. It really helps the show. I'll see you in two weeks.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai