participantOne:(6600-7420): Infamous Indy. participantTwo:(6660-7440): Infamous Indy. participantOne:(7420-14500): Presents the digging up deliver project featuring, the Texas crime travelers and Travis Thompson I'm. participantTwo:(7440-9360): Presents the digging up deliver contra. participantTwo:(10400-14060): Featuring, the Texas crime travelers in Travis Thompson. participantTwo:(14180-15740): I'm, your host, Jill. participantOne:(14500-15080): Your host. participantTwo:(18640-22620): In the annals of American crime few figures with them as large as John. participantOne:(18670-21210): In the annals of American crime few figures. participantOne:(21210-25230): Loom as large as John builder a mastermind bank Heights. participantTwo:(23480-25260): A mastermind bank Heights. participantOne:(25270-31990): His name became synonymous with brazen robberies and daring escapes questions of whether he escape an FBI. participantTwo:(25300-31960): His name became synonymous brazen robberies and daring escapes questions of whether he escape an FBI. participantTwo:(31960-35520): Ambush and the whereabouts of his buried loop persevere. participantOne:(31990-35730): Ambush and the whereabouts of his buried loop persevered. participantOne:(36530-38330): History offers one account. participantTwo:(36670-38330): History offers one account. participantTwo:(38370-40430): But there are whispers that tell us many. participantOne:(38530-40450): But there are whispers that tell us many. participantOne:(41570-44570): Join us as we go digging up cylinder. participantTwo:(41730-44590): Join us as we go digging up cylinder. participantOne:(46440-48700): Hey, welcome back to the digging up billing. participantTwo:(46480-48700): Hey, welcome back to the digging up billing. participantOne:(48700-52440): Your podcast I'm, your host, Joe mellow with me again. participantTwo:(48700-52440): Your podcast I'm, your host, Joe Mello with me again. participantOne:(52480-54320): The team Travis Thompson. participantTwo:(52480-57000): The team Travis Thompson Stewart Fillmore Todd Hiles we're. participantOne:(54320-57000): Stewart Fillmore Todd Hiles we're. participantTwo:(57000-63580): All back for part two of the film report as well as the air discussion. participantOne:(57000-63580): All back for part two of the film report as well as the air discussion. participantOne:(63640-68320): We were just talking about the the discrepancies between the autopsy pictures. participantTwo:(63700-68320): We were just talking about the discrepancies between the autopsy pictures. participantOne:(68650-78210): Pre op Topsy pictures as well as known pictures of John villager, including profile shots from, uh, when he was arrested in Tucson, Arizona. participantTwo:(68650-78210): Pre op Topsy pictures as well as known pictures of John villager, including profile shots from, uh, when he was arrested in Tucson, Arizona. participantOne:(78410-92430): That Stewart put together, a report that ultimately was going to be presented in court as a piece of evidence to kind of add to why the family wants to go and do an examination cemetery. participantTwo:(78410-84670): That Stewart put together, a report that ultimately was going to be presented in court. participantTwo:(84950-92430): As a piece of evidence to kind of add to why the family wants to go and do an examination cemetery. participantTwo:(92470-97170): So if you missed all that or spark go ahead and go back to three and listen to that, but for right now. participantOne:(92470-97170): So if you missed all that her spark go ahead and go back to a three and listen to that, but for right now. participantOne:(97170-101000): We're gonna click continue with the discussion about the years. participantTwo:(97170-101000): We're gonna click continue with the discussion about the years. participantOne:(101320-103160): It's one of my favorite discussions. participantTwo:(101320-103160): It's one of my favorite discussions. participantTwo:(103200-107040): I ever I can't believe you have like you put this together stupid. participantOne:(103300-107040): However, I can't believe you have like you put this together stupid. participantTwo:(107040-108280): This is insanity. participantOne:(107040-108280): This is insanity. participantOne:(108280-112160): That you did this and then it just is so obvious when you look at it. participantTwo:(108280-112160): That you did this and then it just is so obvious when you look at it. participantTwo:(113000-114400): When we left off last episode? participantOne:(113000-114400): When we left off last episode? participantTwo:(114400-119040): We were talking it kind of does from an outsiders perspective and not an expert. participantOne:(114400-119040): We were talking it kind of does from an outsiders perspective and not an expert. participantOne:(119040-119200): <unk>. participantTwo:(119040-119200): <unk>. participantOne:(119200-122400): It looks like John like it looks similar. participantTwo:(119200-122420): It looks like John like it looks similar. participantOne:(122480-123700): Absolutely love ways. participantTwo:(122480-123700): Absolutely love ways. participantOne:(123740-132480): And I mean, you could just like kind of makeup buffering offer things that would be an excuse for hope maybe maybe you're, right. participantTwo:(123740-132480): And I mean, you could just like kind of makeup of buffering offer things that would be an excuse for hope maybe maybe you're, right. participantTwo:(132520-133160): You know what. participantOne:(132520-133160): You know what. participantOne:(134120-135440): I I you know the pictures. participantTwo:(134120-135440): I I you know the pictures. participantTwo:(135440-135660): Weren't. participantOne:(135440-135660): Weren't. participantOne:(135660-136420): That good. participantTwo:(135660-136420): That good. participantTwo:(136460-137220): The cameras weren't. participantOne:(136460-137220): The cameras weren't. participantTwo:(137220-137940): That good. participantOne:(137220-137940): That good. participantOne:(137980-142960): You know, it was a crazy day that day, but transported is another one he had facial surgery. participantTwo:(137980-142960): You know, it was a crazy day that day, but transported is another one he had facial surgery. participantOne:(143000-143740): So, we've kind of done. participantTwo:(143000-143740): So, we've kind of done. participantTwo:(143740-149200): All this, but um, one of the more interesting fax that we can bring up on this podcast because we're. participantOne:(143740-149200): All this, but um, one of the more interesting fax that we can bring up on this podcast because we're. participantOne:(149200-155320): So special because we are this is because we have Travis. participantTwo:(149200-155320): So special because we are this is because we have Travis. participantTwo:(156370-163010): He has the family knowledge from like literally from pass down from his dad to him. participantOne:(156370-163010): He has the family knowledge from like literally from pass down from his dad to him. participantOne:(163050-163850): So Travis. participantTwo:(163050-163850): So Travis. participantTwo:(163850-167110): I want you to jump in and tell our listeners and viewers. participantOne:(163850-167110): I want you to jump in and tell our listeners and viewers. participantOne:(167570-173670): What what's the official story from your family about that day that he was killed? participantTwo:(167570-173670): What what's the official story from your family about that day that he was killed? participantTwo:(173670-177530): And ultimately when, uh, your grandfather. participantOne:(173670-177510): And ultimately when, uh, your grandfather. participantTwo:(178930-185970): Grandfather saw, um, so John's body for the first time and what was that like what was what's been told. participantOne:(178930-185970): Grandfather saw, um, so John's body for the first time and what was that like what was what's been told. participantOne:(187190-189190): Yeah, so back when I was in high school. participantTwo:(187190-189190): Yeah, so back when I was in high school. participantOne:(189190-194190): I was doing a book report on in the Indiana history class. participantTwo:(189190-194190): I was doing a book report on in the Indiana history class. participantOne:(194190-196410): So I was doing a book report on my great uncle. participantTwo:(194190-196410): So I was doing a book report on my great uncle. participantOne:(197550-201970): So when she was sitting with me my grandmother's Francis for everyone, who doesn't know. participantTwo:(197550-201970): So when she was sitting with me my grandmother's Francis for everyone, who doesn't know. participantTwo:(203040-207260): Um, when it came to that. in the my report. participantOne:(203040-207260): Um, when it came to that. in the my report. participantTwo:(207300-219880): She stated Audrey her older sister had went up to Chicago and identify the body first now she said, yes, it was him was with no hesitation, right. participantOne:(207300-219880): She stated Audrey her older sister had went up to Chicago and identify the body first now she said, yes, it was him was with no hesitation, right. participantTwo:(220500-222040): Like my grandfather showed up. participantOne:(220500-222040): Like my grandfather showed up. participantTwo:(223100-225980): And first thing out of his mail said that's, not my that's, not my son. participantOne:(223100-225980): And first thing out of his mail said that's, not my that's, not my son. participantOne:(227000-228000): At that moment. participantTwo:(227000-228000): At that moment. participantOne:(228000-230040): FBI agent grab him. participantTwo:(228000-230040): FBI agent grab him. participantTwo:(230280-232700): Escorted him to a next room. participantOne:(230280-232640): Escorted him to a next room. participantOne:(232960-234960): No one knows what was said in that room. participantTwo:(232960-234960): No one knows what was said in that room. participantTwo:(235000-240920): It was just him and the agents and then he walked back out went up to the body said. participantOne:(235000-240920): It was just him and the agents and then he walked back out went up to the body said. participantTwo:(240920-241860): Yes, this is my son. participantOne:(240920-241860): Yes, this is my son. participantTwo:(243890-245610): And who was listening to him. participantOne:(243890-245610): And who was listening to him. participantOne:(245610-245890): Say. participantTwo:(245610-245890): Say. participantOne:(245890-246370): Yes, that's. participantTwo:(245890-246370): Yes, that's. participantOne:(246370-249430): My son was that like the <unk>. participantTwo:(246370-249430): My son was that like the <unk>. participantTwo:(249430-255170): I talked people from Cook county and then all the agents that were on scene. participantOne:(249430-255170): I talked people from Cook county and then all the agents that were on scene. participantOne:(255930-261410): Where, um, <unk>, sorry, go ahead what my Grandma? participantTwo:(255930-261410): Where, um, <unk>, sorry, go ahead what my Grandma? participantOne:(261410-265380): So I I'm pretty sure purpose was there. participantTwo:(261410-265380): So I I'm pretty sure purpose was there. participantOne:(265620-279320): Can I remember her saying that several times that that Grand Paul had to actually face to face conversation with Melvin purpose and he was one of the agents that went to the side room with my great grandfather? participantTwo:(265620-279320): Can I remember her saying that several times that that Grand Paul had to actually face to face conversation with Melvin purpose and he was one of the agents that went to the side room with my great grandfather? participantTwo:(281000-281840): And at the time. participantOne:(281000-281840): And at the time. participantOne:(281840-282380): Stewart, right. participantTwo:(281840-282380): Stewart, right. participantTwo:(282380-285560): Melvin purpose is the agent in charge of Chicago, right, correct. participantOne:(282380-285560): Melvin purpose is the agent in charge of Chicago, right, correct. participantTwo:(285600-292480): Yes, uh, uh, Melvin purpose was a head of the Chicago API office. participantOne:(285600-292480): Yes, uh, uh, Melvin purpose was a head of the Chicago API office. participantTwo:(292520-306700): He was head of what's what's called the deliver squad he'd somewhat been usurped in his power because Jager, who was not happy with them a by a guy named Sam, Sam Callie a Callies later. participantOne:(292520-306700): He was head of what's what's called the deliver squad he'd somewhat been usurped in his power because Jager, who was not happy with them a by a guy named Sam, Sam Callie a Callies later. participantTwo:(306700-308420): Killed in again fight with baby. participantOne:(306700-308420): Killed in again fight with baby. participantOne:(308420-318720): Face Nelson after the delivery killing, uh, but but, but for all intents and purposes at that. a Melvin Purvis was the man a in charge. participantTwo:(308420-311080): Face Nelson after the deliver killing. participantTwo:(311400-318720): Uh, but but, but for all intents and purposes at that. a Melvin Purvis was the man a in charge. participantTwo:(319780-336040): Also something else that comes in mind that just because of what we're talking about and all the discrepancies and mysteries and FBI is involvement then in what we talked about the left episode, their involvement in this still back then. participantOne:(319780-336040): Also something else that comes in mind that just because of what we're talking about and all the discrepancies and mysteries and FBI is involvement then in what we talked about the left episode, their involvement in this still back then. participantOne:(336340-337880): My great grandfather. participantTwo:(336340-337880): My great grandfather. participantTwo:(337880-341160): Could not afford the $50 to involve him. participantOne:(337880-341160): Could not afford the $50 to involve him. participantOne:(341260-342480): Embalm John villager. participantTwo:(341260-342480): Embalm John villager. participantOne:(342480-346980): So he had to get money offering from the Church back home. participantTwo:(342480-346980): So he had to get money offering from the Church back home. participantOne:(348040-348920): To pay for that. participantTwo:(348040-348920): To pay for that. participantTwo:(348920-353720): So again, if you couldn't pay for $50 to embalm him. participantOne:(348920-353720): So again, if you couldn't pay for $50 to embalm him. participantOne:(353980-356900): He sure could not have paid for two feet of concrete. participantTwo:(353980-356900): He sure could not have paid for two feet of concrete. participantOne:(356900-357640): Put over the Grace. participantTwo:(356900-357640): Put over the Grace. participantTwo:(360000-366300): What did your did your grandmother say how the family was notified that he had been killed by the FBI? participantOne:(360000-366300): What did your did your grandmother say how the family was notified that he had been killed by the FBI? participantTwo:(367600-369100): I'll trying to think. participantOne:(367600-369100): I'll trying to think. participantOne:(369640-375900): Um, I actually think a reporter from Chicago contacted the family. participantTwo:(369640-375880): Um, I actually think a reporter from Chicago contacted the family. participantTwo:(376500-387840): Um, because that same week we have actually original photos of when John was put into the patio again before he was taking it to kinda morgue. participantOne:(376500-387840): Um, because that same week we have actually original photos of when John was put into the patio again before he was taking it to kinda morgue. participantOne:(388680-389560): That reporter. participantTwo:(388680-389560): That reporter. participantOne:(389560-391140): I believe I don't know his name. participantTwo:(389560-391140): I believe I don't know his name. participantTwo:(391620-395060): Um, stop my head, but I believe he's the one who contacted the family. participantOne:(391620-395060): Um, stop my head, but I believe he's the one who contacted the family. participantOne:(397230-399250): And for inside knowledge about journalism. participantTwo:(397230-399250): And for inside knowledge about journalism. participantOne:(399290-400210): Do not do that. participantTwo:(399290-400210): Do not do that. participantOne:(400210-403130): If you're a reporter you're, not supposed to do that. participantTwo:(400210-403130): If you're a reporter you're, not supposed to do that. participantTwo:(403130-406610): You're supposed to lead or a law enforcement officials. participantOne:(403130-406610): You're supposed to lead or a law enforcement officials. participantTwo:(406650-409670): Tell the family that their loved ones been killed or died. participantOne:(406650-409670): Tell the family that their loved ones been killed or died. participantOne:(409710-415370): You're, not supposed to call them at their house and be like Hey, by the way you know, Johnny's dad. participantTwo:(409710-415390): You're, not supposed to call them at their house and be like Hey, by the way you know, Johnny's dad. participantOne:(415450-415790): . participantTwo:(415450-415790): . participantTwo:(417120-418780): Let me let me ask you one more thing. participantOne:(417120-418780): Let me let me ask you one more thing. participantTwo:(418820-419340): Travis. participantOne:(418820-419340): Travis. participantOne:(419340-430300): So, so that when they when how where where it was John sister when they found out, they were home and then had to drive three hours. participantTwo:(419340-433840): So, so that when they when how where where it was John sister when they found out, they were home and then had to drive three hours <unk>. participantOne:(432820-434540): Holder. participantTwo:(435100-438120): So she had married had children was living on her own. participantOne:(435100-438120): So she had married had children was living on her own. participantTwo:(438180-441680): So she was contacted and it went up there. participantOne:(438180-441680): So she was contacted and it went up there. participantOne:(441680-445520): first and then you know, back then we did have cell phones. participantTwo:(441680-445520): first and then you know, back then we did have cell phones. participantTwo:(445560-446480): Sure, it. participantOne:(445560-446480): Sure, it. participantTwo:(446520-450040): So it was harder to get a hold of my great grandfather. participantOne:(446520-450040): So it was harder to get a hold of my great grandfather. participantOne:(450040-452020): Does I mean, I mean to my knowledge? participantTwo:(450040-452020): Does I mean, I mean to my knowledge? participantOne:(452020-467390): I think Grandma said he was actually working in the form or outside doing, um, doing normal farm stores at the time when, um, when someone actually had to come from the town and had to go out there to him and tell him. participantTwo:(452020-467380): I think Grandma said he was actually working the farm or outside doing, um, doing normal farm stores at the time when, um, when someone actually had to come from the town and had to go out there to him and tell him. participantOne:(467530-469470): Yeah, so he was in <unk>. participantTwo:(467580-469460): Yeah, so he was in <unk>. participantOne:(470290-470690): That's. participantTwo:(470290-470690): That's. participantTwo:(470730-473130): What I'm understanding you're out at that time? participantOne:(470730-473130): What I'm understanding you're out at that time? participantOne:(473130-474330): An hour at night. participantTwo:(473130-474330): An hour at night. participantTwo:(474470-484250): I think he's probably milking calls or feed them or you know doing whatever forms charge he had to do because he was again alone doing work in the form himself. participantOne:(474470-484250): I think he's probably milking calls or feed them or you know doing whatever forms charge he had to do because he was again alone doing work in the form himself. participantOne:(484390-486890): He and John was killed at night, right. participantTwo:(484390-486890): He and John was killed at night, right. participantTwo:(487050-490230): Yes, and then so that would've been probably the next day. participantOne:(487070-490230): Yes, and then so that would've been probably the next day. participantTwo:(492010-494070): How I understand he was notified that night? participantOne:(492050-494070): How I understand he was notified that night? participantTwo:(494290-497070): Oh. he was notified that night interest [laughter]. participantOne:(494290-497070): Oh. he was notified that night interest [laughter]. participantTwo:(497810-500130): Um, and then I just it's to me. participantOne:(497830-500130): Um, and then I just it's to me. participantOne:(500470-505610): So Audrey was went up by herself or went with your great grandfather. participantTwo:(500570-505610): So Audrey was went up by herself or went with your great grandfather. participantTwo:(506900-508020): She was there first. participantOne:(506900-508020): She was there first. participantOne:(508020-510140): So she went up there before he did. participantTwo:(508020-510140): So she went up there before he did. participantTwo:(510220-512660): So she just drove and got up there first. participantOne:(510220-512740): So she just drove and got up there first. participantOne:(512800-519860): Yes, and I think Hubert brought my great grandfather which was Johns brother because. participantTwo:(512800-519860): Yes, and I think Hubert brought my great grandfather which was Johns brother because. participantTwo:(521110-524510): You know, John senior, if you ever watch any old videos of him. participantOne:(521110-524510): You know, John senior, if you ever watch any old videos of him. participantOne:(524590-527470): Um, you can tell the whole villager. participantTwo:(524590-527470): Um, you can tell the whole billing or. participantTwo:(528500-531680): Um, exculpated with his son with wearing him down. participantOne:(528500-531680): Um, exculpated with his fund with wearing him down. participantOne:(531680-532760): I mean, you can tell him motion. participantTwo:(531680-532760): I mean, you can tell him motion. participantTwo:(532760-536040): He was in the video, which is great we've audio of it. participantOne:(532760-536040): He was in the video, which is great way of audio of it. participantTwo:(536080-542840): Um, so I don't think he would've been emotionally able to drive from <unk>, Indiana to Chicago. participantOne:(536080-542840): Um, so I don't think he would've been emotionally able to drive from <unk>, Indiana to Chicago. participantTwo:(542840-544160): So I I've understood. participantOne:(542840-544160): So I I've understood. participantOne:(544160-552920): Why believe Hubert, drove him and your Grand grandmother was there two at the autopsy or at the body identification or no she's too young? participantTwo:(544160-552940): Why believe Herbert drove him and your Grand grandmother was there too at the autopsy or at the body identification or no she's too young? participantOne:(552960-554880): No, no she's too young. participantTwo:(552980-554880): No, no, she was too young. participantOne:(554880-555680): Yeah, I. participantTwo:(554880-560420): Yeah, I I I don't think they would've brought her or Doris I'm up there. participantOne:(556560-560420): I don't think they would've brought her or Doris I'm up there. participantOne:(560420-561280): They're too young. participantTwo:(560420-561320): They're too young. participantOne:(561540-565680): And I don't think my great grandfather would want to expose them to that. participantTwo:(561580-565680): And I don't think my great grandfather would want to expose them to that. participantTwo:(565760-567100): So, I'm not really sure. participantOne:(565780-567100): So, I'm not really sure. participantOne:(567100-571380): Grandma really never went in detail where she went or what had happened. participantTwo:(567100-571340): Grandma really never went in detail where she went or what happened. participantTwo:(571340-571600): But. participantOne:(571380-571600): But. participantTwo:(573030-576650): The story like I told you to relate that's, what her father told her. participantOne:(573030-576670): The story like I told you to relate that's, what her father told her. participantTwo:(576690-577430): What happened? participantOne:(576710-577410): What happened? participantTwo:(577830-579670): Yep, they went into a different room. participantOne:(577830-579670): Yep, they went into a different room. participantTwo:(579710-584050): Something was said and all of a sudden he changed his mind now. participantOne:(579710-584050): Something was said and all of a sudden he changed his mind now. participantOne:(584090-588710): That's, my son, yeah, and there's more to that later on <unk>. participantTwo:(584090-588710): That's, my son, yeah, and there's more to that later on <unk>. participantOne:(588710-590190): We get further into it. participantTwo:(588710-590190): We get further into it. participantTwo:(591080-596840): What my feelings are after the fact of what the family did, but sure sure? participantOne:(591080-596840): What my feelings are after the fact of what the family did, but sure sure? participantTwo:(596880-598100): Yeah, we'll we'll. participantOne:(596880-598100): Yeah, we'll we'll. participantTwo:(598100-598800): Go into this. participantOne:(598100-598800): Go into this. participantOne:(598860-599780): Just rundown. participantTwo:(598860-599780): Just rundown. participantOne:(599780-602080): The family members I'm again and I'm. participantTwo:(599780-602080): The family members I'm again and I'm. participantOne:(602080-605780): Sorry, we have John villagers senior, right. participantTwo:(602080-605780): Sorry, we have John villagers senior, right. participantTwo:(605780-607040): Your great grandfather. participantOne:(605780-607040): Your great grandfather. participantTwo:(608500-610000): And then you said Doris. participantOne:(608500-610000): And then you said Doris. participantTwo:(610960-613740): Was the oldest <unk>. participantOne:(610960-613740): Was the oldest <unk>. participantTwo:(614100-616040): Yep, yeah, Audrey. participantOne:(614100-616040): Yep, yeah, Audrey. participantTwo:(616440-618360): And John were full spelling. participantOne:(616440-618360): And John were full spelling. participantOne:(619520-621220): Then it went Hubert. participantTwo:(619520-621220): Then it went Hubert. participantTwo:(621260-624780): Doris and my grandmother Francis warehouse siblings. participantOne:(621260-624780): Doris and my grandmother Francis warehouse siblings. participantOne:(625800-626200): Got it. participantTwo:(625800-626200): Got it. participantOne:(626240-632380): So your grandmother had two older siblings that were half related to John villager. participantTwo:(626240-632380): So your grandmother had two older siblings that were half related to John villager. participantTwo:(632480-636300): And John had two younger siblings that were Audrey and. participantOne:(632480-636300): And John had two younger siblings that were Audrey and. participantTwo:(637120-637420): Hubert. participantOne:(637120-637420): Hubert. participantOne:(638500-640560): No, no, our older. participantTwo:(638500-640560): No, no, our older. participantTwo:(640560-643620): So Audrey and John shared the same mother and father that's. participantOne:(640560-643620): So Audrey and John shared the same mother and father that's. participantTwo:(643620-643940): It that's. participantOne:(643620-643940): It that's. participantTwo:(643940-644240): What I mean? participantOne:(643940-644240): What I mean? participantOne:(644300-656170): Yeah, so Audrey and Audrey and John's, mom died when I think John was a three years old four years old a and then John senior remarried, a few years later. participantTwo:(644300-656170): Yeah, so Audrey and Audrey and John's, mom died when I think John was a three years old four years old a and then John senior remarried, a few years later. participantTwo:(656450-660890): Um, and then I had a family with Francis. participantOne:(656450-660890): Um, and then I had a family with Francis. participantOne:(660890-663970): Doris and Hubert a after that. participantTwo:(660890-663970): Doris and Hubert a after that. participantTwo:(664010-667230): Yep, just wanted to make sure because I sometimes get confused. participantOne:(664010-667230): Yep, just wanted to make sure because I sometimes get confused. participantTwo:(667230-668450): Sometimes on that stuff. participantOne:(667230-668450): Sometimes on that stuff. participantTwo:(668450-673070): So I wanna make sure the listeners are following along in terms of the family tree line. participantOne:(668450-673070): So I wanna make sure the listeners are following along in terms of the family tree line. participantOne:(673390-675850): No you're, not the first one asked that I get asked a lot. participantTwo:(673390-674810): No you're, not the first one asked. participantTwo:(674810-675850): I asked a lot. participantOne:(675850-677050): How many fill in the names? participantTwo:(675850-677050): How many the names? participantTwo:(677050-682270): So yeah, yeah, um, yeah, you got a quick question for Travis. participantOne:(677050-682350): So yeah, yeah, um, yeah, he got a quick question for Travis. participantOne:(682750-686790): Yeah, so you mentioned you did this for your senior high school paper. participantTwo:(682750-686790): Yeah, so you mentioned you did this for your senior high school paper. participantOne:(686850-688950): Yes, what grade did you get on this. participantTwo:(686850-691050): Yes, what grade did you get on this a plus plus plus. participantOne:(689070-691790): I got a plus plus plus it <unk>. participantOne:(692110-692850): Well, it was great. participantTwo:(692130-692930): Was great. participantOne:(692850-694970): It was, I was a freshman in high school. participantTwo:(692930-694970): Was, um, I was a freshman in high school. participantTwo:(694970-702190): When I took this class and this was only a senior junior senior class, but the history teacher wanted me in that class? participantOne:(694970-702170): When I took this class and this was only a senior junior senior class, but the history teacher wanted me in that class? participantOne:(702210-706330): While I was in school. participantTwo:(702230-706030): While I was in school. participantOne:(706770-708090): Umm, the school. participantTwo:(706790-708130): Umm, the school. participantOne:(708130-712370): Well, he Mister Emerson with the a teacher's name. participantTwo:(708170-712370): Well, he the Mister Emerson with a teacher's name. participantTwo:(712410-714990): He made it a policy that no one else. participantOne:(712410-714990): He made it a policy that no one else. participantOne:(714990-718870): Could do a delivery report while I was in school [laughter]. participantTwo:(714990-719030): Could do a delivery report while I was in school [laughter]. participantTwo:(719030-721890): You keep the original your original report does he still have it. participantOne:(719050-721910): You keep the original your original report does he still have it. participantTwo:(722270-728500): Um, actually, I do my dad has it to go get it [laughter]. participantOne:(722310-724710): Um, actually, I do my dad has it. participantOne:(725630-729130): To go get it [laughter]. participantTwo:(728500-730120): Okay, go get it right now. participantOne:(729170-730130): Go get it right now. participantTwo:(730120-731220): Get up and go get it now. participantOne:(730130-732130): Get up and go get it <unk>. participantTwo:(731220-732200): I'm gonna copy. participantOne:(732130-733030): I wanna we <unk>. participantTwo:(732200-732820): I wanna read. participantOne:(733030-733810): Yeah, me too. participantTwo:(733040-733800): Yeah, me too. participantTwo:(733800-736980): Because this is that's firsthand account knowledge from your Grandma. participantOne:(733810-736970): Because this is that's firsthand account knowledge from your Grandma. participantOne:(737010-740450): No, yeah, my grandmother set there in word for word. participantTwo:(737080-740440): No, yeah, my grandmother set there in word for word. participantTwo:(740620-743020): Um, I was listening in her type. participantOne:(740630-743010): Um, I was listening in her type. participantOne:(743010-745650): I wish I would recorded it, but you know, hindsight. participantTwo:(743020-745660): I wish I would recorded it, but you know, hindsight. participantOne:(746150-750710): I mean, everyone else is gonna be like you had that firsthand knowledge should recorded, but that's my grandmother. participantTwo:(746150-750710): I mean, everyone else is gonna be like you had that firsthand knowledge should recorded, but that's my grandmother. participantTwo:(750710-753210): I wasn't you know, it's a family thing. participantOne:(750710-753210): I wasn't it, you know, it's a family thing. participantTwo:(753210-754690): It wasn't to me. participantOne:(753210-754690): It wasn't to me. participantOne:(754930-758410): You know, like any like if you all had a famous history, you know, it's. participantTwo:(754930-758470): You know, like any like if you all had a famous history, you know, it's. participantTwo:(760130-764690): Like all of us just a famous relatives, you know, [laughter]. participantOne:(760130-764690): Like all of us just a famous relatives, you know, [laughter]. participantTwo:(764770-769030): Yeah, I it was great and it was. participantOne:(764910-769030): Yeah, I it was great and it was. participantOne:(770750-772390): It was a lot for grandmother. participantTwo:(770750-772390): It was a lot for grandmother. participantTwo:(772390-773990): Do that because there's a lot of motion? participantOne:(772390-773990): Do that because there's a lot of motion? participantOne:(773990-775110): Memories coming up. participantTwo:(773990-775110): Memories coming up. participantTwo:(775110-776310): So we have to take breaks. participantOne:(775110-776310): So we have to take breaks. participantTwo:(778020-780660): Um, interesting Travis. participantOne:(778060-779620): Interesting. participantOne:(780160-780660): Travis. participantOne:(780660-787500): Thanks for sharing that because I think we're in this autopsy report stuff and it's important here. participantTwo:(780660-787500): Thanks for sharing that because I think we're in this autopsy report stuff and it's important here. participantOne:(787500-792980): People that there was question marks about your great grandfather's reaction as well. participantTwo:(787500-792980): People that there was question marks about your great grandfather's reaction as well. participantTwo:(793020-802310): So, and take it for what it is folks right Stewart Todd back me up on this, but second hand knowledge 3rd hand knowledge at this. participantOne:(793020-802310): So, and take it for what it is folks right Stewart Todd back me up on this, but second hand knowledge 3rd hand knowledge at this. participantTwo:(802450-803950): I mean, how reliable is it. participantOne:(802450-803950): I mean, how reliable is it. participantOne:(803990-809190): I mean, I know Travis your story and you know, it, but in terms of witness. participantTwo:(803990-809230): I mean, I know Travis your story and you know, it, but in terms of witness. participantOne:(809350-811510): Um, credibility and stuff like that. participantTwo:(809350-811510): Um, credibility and stuff like that. participantOne:(811550-813690): I mean, is it is it's it's? participantTwo:(811550-813690): I mean, is it is it's it's? participantTwo:(813690-817770): Not something that we could take wholeheartedly as fact. participantOne:(813690-817770): Not something that we could take wholeheartedly as fact. participantTwo:(818250-821210): It's just something else a story that's been brought up right guys. participantOne:(818250-821210): It's just something else a story that's been brought up right guys. participantOne:(821210-822270): I mean, back me up on this. participantTwo:(821210-822270): I mean, back me up on this. participantTwo:(823500-825380): Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. participantOne:(823500-825380): Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. participantOne:(826260-833880): Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, there's there's, nothing like getting firsthand accounts a from someone that was that was there. participantTwo:(826260-833840): Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, there's there's, nothing like getting firsthand accounts a from someone that was that was there. participantTwo:(833980-846400): I mean, you know, we can you know, we can study books and and read that stuff, but you know, there is absolutely nothing like talking to the people that were actually there. participantOne:(833980-846420): I mean, you know, we can you know, we can study books and and read that stuff, but you know, there is absolutely nothing like talking to the people that were actually there. participantOne:(847430-852510): And just wait and but weighing it through telephone through 90 years of telephone with Travis, right. participantTwo:(847430-852510): And just wait and but weighing it through telephone through 90 years of telephone with Travis, right. participantOne:(852510-854030): Because he heard it from his Grandma. participantTwo:(852510-853990): Because he heard it from his Grandma. participantTwo:(854150-856090): Who obviously heard it from somebody else? participantOne:(854150-856090): Who obviously heard it from somebody else? participantOne:(856090-857370): And memories and time. participantTwo:(856090-857370): And memories and time. participantOne:(857370-861130): And you know, human nature wanna change things. participantTwo:(857370-861130): And you know, human nature wanna change things. participantTwo:(861130-863330): And just it's an interesting. participantOne:(861130-863330): And just it's an interesting. participantOne:(863370-864970): Tidbit to add to this. participantTwo:(863370-864970): Tidbit to add to this. participantTwo:(866090-868730): Pot of just craziness. participantOne:(866090-868730): Pot of just craziness. participantOne:(868770-871550): So, yep, um, thanks man. participantTwo:(868770-871550): So, yep, um, thanks man. participantTwo:(871550-877270): We really appreciate this is love like I said, I love it. participantOne:(871550-877270): We really appreciate this is love like I said, I love it. participantTwo:(877310-882790): I I mean these are stories that I'm gonna be sharing with all the listeners and and you three as well. participantOne:(877310-882790): I I mean these are stories that I'm gonna be sharing with all the listeners and and you three as well. participantOne:(883540-885520): That have only been in our family. participantTwo:(883540-885520): That have only been in our family. participantOne:(885580-888260): Um, not a lot of this has got out this stuff. participantTwo:(885580-888260): Um, not a lot of this has got out this stuff. participantTwo:(888260-892980): My grandmother's stories never changed the entire time. participantOne:(888260-892980): My grandmother's stories never changed the entire time. participantTwo:(892980-894140): I you know, I was with her. participantOne:(892980-894140): I you know, I was with her. participantOne:(894140-899640): So, um, she was a very you know, the donor thing bought like I said a lot of bad. participantTwo:(894140-899640): So, um, she was a very you know, the donor thing bought like I said a lot of bad. participantTwo:(899640-900300): Memories. participantOne:(899640-900320): Memories. participantTwo:(900340-913340): So her talking when she did you listened because it was you know, it was really asked a lot of questions about because she would just start talking about it if she felt like doing. participantOne:(900360-913340): So her talking when she did you listened because it was you know, it was really asked a lot of questions about because she would just start talking about it if she felt like doing. participantTwo:(914530-915490): And this is awesome. participantOne:(914530-915490): And this is awesome. participantOne:(915490-919390): That this is the only podcast that you're gonna hear Travis is stories on. participantTwo:(915490-919390): That this is the only podcast that you're gonna hear Travis is stories on. participantTwo:(922770-923230): You. participantOne:(922770-923230): You. participantTwo:(923230-929970): Um, the the, uh, your grandmother and the stories and obviously we're trying to get Mike Thompson as well. participantOne:(923230-929970): Um, the the, uh, your grandmother and the stories and obviously we're trying to get Mike Thompson as well. participantOne:(929970-931730): Your dad on the on the bypass eventually. participantTwo:(929970-931730): Your dad on the on the bypass eventually. participantOne:(931730-933910): We will we'll have to go to we'll. participantTwo:(931730-933910): We will we'll have to go to we'll. participantOne:(933910-938970): Have to go there and take care of take care of Mike and let him tell you because. participantTwo:(933910-938970): Have to go there and take care of take care of Mike and let him tell you because. participantTwo:(940010-941150): Let's let's face. participantOne:(940010-941150): Let's let's face. participantOne:(941150-942890): It he's got story more stores in you. participantTwo:(941150-942890): It he's got story more stores in you. participantOne:(942890-943750): Travis. participantTwo:(942890-943750): Travis. participantTwo:(943810-945510): Oh. he's, definitely got more specialist. participantOne:(943830-945510): Oh. he's, definitely got more specialist. participantOne:(945510-951070): And he got to hang out with Hubert and the other relatives in here. participantTwo:(945510-951070): And he got to hang out with Hubert and the other relatives in here. participantTwo:(951070-952770): They're firsthand accounts. participantOne:(951070-952770): They're firsthand accounts. participantTwo:(952810-968870): Um, with which is more amazing because when during our endeavors Stewart with me when we're going through all the other TV series and dad would just start talking there's a lot of stories that I had never heard before that you know, with someone to trigger that memory. participantOne:(952810-968870): Um, with which is more amazing because when during our endeavors Stewart with me when we're going through all the other TV series and dad would just start talking there's a lot of stories that I had never heard before that you know, with someone to trigger that memory. participantOne:(969650-971210): Great, great. participantTwo:(969650-971210): Great, great. participantTwo:(971210-979580): Well, let's get back into a little bit more detail from Stewart on the year discrepancies from the autopsy report. participantOne:(971210-979580): Well, let's get back into a little bit more detail from Stewart on the rear discrepancies from the autopsy report. participantOne:(979880-982860): We're watching congratulations on you too. participantTwo:(979880-982860): We're watching congratulations on you too. participantOne:(982900-984360): Thanks for watching on you too. participantTwo:(982900-984360): Thanks for watching on you too. participantOne:(984600-985820): You got to the right place. participantTwo:(984600-985820): You got to the right place. participantTwo:(985820-993320): So for this episode because it's a very visual episode, but we're trying to do our best from a Pike pass perspective to the years. participantOne:(985820-993320): So for this episode because it's a very visual episode, but we're trying to do our best from a Pike pass perspective to the years. participantTwo:(993360-994360): They look weird. participantOne:(993360-994300): They look weird. participantOne:(994440-996600): They just look different. participantTwo:(994440-996600): They just look different. participantTwo:(997100-998480): Um, you can't attribute. participantOne:(997100-998480): Um, you can't attribute. participantTwo:(998480-1000220): It to the lighting in my opinion. participantOne:(998480-1000220): It to the lighting in my opinion. participantOne:(1000900-1002160): You can't really attribute. participantTwo:(1000900-1002160): You can't really attribute. participantTwo:(1002160-1016180): It to the the autopsy procedure of peeling a face down and taking out the school cap and then replacing it because the picture where one of the pictures were looking at is a pre autopsy phone, correct. participantOne:(1002160-1016180): It to the the autopsy procedure of peeling a face down and taking out the school cap and then replacing it because the picture where one of the pictures were looking at is a pre autopsy phone, correct. participantTwo:(1016220-1017640): Yep, Stewart. participantOne:(1016240-1017640): Yep, Stewart. participantOne:(1017640-1021280): Were where else do you think we need to go to to let people know about this. participantTwo:(1017640-1021280): Were where else do you think we need to go to to let people know about this. participantTwo:(1021320-1022600): The year discrepancies here. participantOne:(1021320-1022560): The air discrepancies here. participantTwo:(1024400-1028440): Well, I mean, you know, to me they just it just jumps out at you. participantOne:(1024400-1028440): Well, I mean, you know, to me they just it just jumps out at you. participantOne:(1028480-1032660): Uh, so many of the, uh, so so now, Joe you've pulled up. participantTwo:(1028480-1032680): Uh, so many of the, uh, so so now, Joe you've pulled up. participantOne:(1032700-1037340): This was the initial picture that I saw where I'm looking at it. participantTwo:(1032720-1037340): This was the initial picture that I saw where I'm looking at it. participantOne:(1037340-1038440): I'm thinking what. participantTwo:(1037340-1038440): I'm thinking what. participantTwo:(1038480-1039800): What is different here? participantOne:(1038480-1039800): What is different here? participantTwo:(1039800-1046100): I obviously, when someone's dead, it, you know, no, nobody nobody looks good when they're dead, right. participantOne:(1039800-1046100): I obviously, when someone's dead, it, you know, no, nobody nobody looks good when they're dead, right. participantOne:(1046240-1051090): But it something kept jumping out at me is like what is different here. participantTwo:(1046240-1051090): But it something kept jumping out at me is like what is different here. participantOne:(1051090-1052130): What is different? participantTwo:(1051090-1052130): What is different? participantOne:(1052170-1055670): That I see this is supposedly deliver this is a picture. participantTwo:(1052170-1055670): That I see this is supposedly deliver this is a picture. participantTwo:(1055710-1057690): Obviously taking of him in the morgue. participantOne:(1055710-1057690): Obviously taking of him in the morgue. participantOne:(1058410-1060670): Um, it's, just <unk>. participantTwo:(1058410-1060670): Um, it's, just <unk>. participantTwo:(1060750-1062750): How can I reconcile what what? participantOne:(1060750-1062750): How can I reconcile what what? participantOne:(1062790-1063650): What's different? participantTwo:(1062790-1063650): What's different? participantTwo:(1063650-1065150): And then eventually it hit me. participantOne:(1063650-1065190): And then eventually it hit me. participantOne:(1065290-1066510): Look at the years. participantTwo:(1065290-1066510): Look at the years. participantTwo:(1066830-1069390): Villager had somewhat kinda protruding years. participantOne:(1066830-1069390): Villager had somewhat kinda protruding years. participantOne:(1069390-1075830): If you look at him a you know, front on from face on and if you look at the course. participantTwo:(1069390-1075830): If you look at him a you know, front on from face on and if you look at the course. participantTwo:(1077060-1079920): Uh, again, those years or more pin back. participantOne:(1077060-1079920): Uh, again, those years or more pin back. participantOne:(1079920-1087700): They do not protrude near as much and that is actually this is the very first photo that I looked at where I thought, huh. participantTwo:(1079920-1087740): They do not protrude near as much and that is actually this is the very first photo that I looked at where I thought, huh. participantOne:(1087740-1089520): What's what's up with the years? participantTwo:(1087780-1089520): What's what's up with the years? participantOne:(1089520-1091020): Why are the ears different? participantTwo:(1089520-1091020): Why are the ears different? participantOne:(1091420-1094980): And so then I started trying to to find any pictures. participantTwo:(1091420-1094980): And so then I started trying to to find any pictures. participantTwo:(1094980-1099730): I could of you know, uh, when was alive. participantOne:(1094980-1099720): I could of you know, uh, when was alive. participantOne:(1099760-1108400): When was dead and compare those those photos of you know, the various, uh, the angles and shapes of the years? participantTwo:(1099770-1106950): When villager was dead and compare those those photos of you know, the various, uh, uh, angles? participantTwo:(1106950-1108330): And shapes of the years. participantTwo:(1108910-1115350): So, <unk>, the the years on the autopsy is that pre autopsy post shooting. participantOne:(1108920-1115340): So, <unk>, the the years on the autopsy is that pre autopsy post shooting. participantTwo:(1115800-1124940): So yeah, it's hard to tell on on the one that's on the screen right now whether it's pre or post autopsy, obviously he's been cleaned up. participantOne:(1115800-1124940): So yeah, it's hard to tell on on the one that's on the screen right now whether it's pre or post autopsy, obviously he's been cleaned up. participantOne:(1125060-1130700): You know, the you don't see the dried a running blood you know, on the face. participantTwo:(1125060-1126340): You know, the the you don't. participantTwo:(1126340-1130700): See the dried, a running blood you know, on the face. participantOne:(1130740-1143140): You clearly see some of the, um, uh, I think on the on the left side of his face or some scratches underneath his right Iris actually where the bullet that killed him, exited. participantTwo:(1130740-1142600): You clearly see some of the, um, uh, I think on the on the left side of his face or some scratches, a underneath his right eyes actually where the bullet that killed him. participantTwo:(1142640-1143140): Exited. participantTwo:(1144180-1154400): Um, and then so along the top of the screen, you see three different photos of villager one is from the one on the far upper left is deliver 1924. participantOne:(1144180-1154420): Um, and then so along the top of the screen, you see three different photos of villager one is from the one on the far upper left is deliver 1924. participantTwo:(1154460-1158340): The one in the middle upper is deliver 1934. participantOne:(1154460-1158340): The one in the middle upper is deliver 1934. participantTwo:(1158500-1164500): And and the one on the far right top is billinger in 1934. participantOne:(1158500-1164500): And and the one on the far right top is billinger in 1934. participantOne:(1164500-1179630): And the in July after he was killed and the photos on the bottom or just close up of the very same photos at the top and if you look at the the the first two at the bottom, you know, the the left and the center picture. participantTwo:(1164500-1179630): And the in July after he was killed and the photos on the bottom or just close up of the very same photos at the top and if you look at the the the first two at the bottom, you know, the the left and the center picture. participantTwo:(1179630-1181970): That's from 19241934. participantOne:(1179630-1181970): That's from 19241934. participantTwo:(1182630-1186310): Those years, look, you know, a pretty much the same. participantOne:(1182630-1186290): Those years, look, you know, a pretty much the same. participantOne:(1186330-1196050): Yeah, no, I mean, you literally go back and forth and they look exactly the same that those years there he looks really he really he's handsome looking young, man though. participantTwo:(1186350-1196050): Yeah, no, I mean, you literally go back and forth and they look exactly the same that those years there he looks really he really he's handsome looking young, man though. participantTwo:(1196910-1198190): That picture on the top left. participantOne:(1196910-1198190): That picture on the top left. participantOne:(1198190-1198810): What is it from? participantTwo:(1198190-1198810): What is it from? participantOne:(1200030-1200670): Huh. participantTwo:(1200030-1200670): Huh. participantTwo:(1201130-1204190): [laughter]. participantOne:(1201150-1204190): [laughter]. participantOne:(1204230-1205930): You know, I'm I'm not <unk>. participantTwo:(1204230-1205930): You know, I'm I'm not <unk>. participantOne:(1206470-1209290): You know, I'm not not actually sure taught you mentioned that. participantTwo:(1206470-1209290): You know, I'm not not actually sure taught you mentioned that. participantTwo:(1209330-1212870): Uh, what what that's from a you know, he was arrested in 24 that's. participantOne:(1209330-1212870): Uh, what what that's from a you know, he was arrested in 24 that's. participantTwo:(1212870-1219310): When his uh, you know, he's attacked, the grosser in a Frank Morgan in Morris Ville that's? participantOne:(1212870-1219310): When his uh, you know, he's attacked, the grosser in a Frank Morgan in Morris Ville that's? participantTwo:(1219350-1220370): What started him that's? participantOne:(1219350-1220370): What started him that's? participantOne:(1220370-1224190): What sent him to prison that's when this whole autopsy really began? participantTwo:(1220370-1224190): What sent him to prison that's when this whole autopsy really began? participantOne:(1224730-1229190): Um, so I'm assuming that that is a Meg shop mug shot from that time. participantTwo:(1224730-1229190): Um, so I'm assuming that that is a Meg shop mug shot from that time. participantOne:(1230000-1233400): Ah, but but to be honest with you, I don't that as we said here, right now. participantTwo:(1230000-1233400): Ah, but but to be honest with you, I don't that as we said here, right now. participantTwo:(1233400-1235640): I can't tell you exactly where that pictures from. participantOne:(1233400-1235640): I can't tell you exactly where that pictures from. participantTwo:(1235640-1237600): But that is billinger 1924. participantOne:(1235640-1237600): But that is billinger 1924. participantOne:(1237640-1242580): Yeah, I mean, he's here is impeccable first of all that that hair cut his style is in now. participantTwo:(1237640-1242560): Yeah, I mean, his hair is impeccable first of all that that hair cut his style is in now. participantTwo:(1242840-1248160): Oh. yeah, like you know everybody wants that that left he's got the bow tie on he's. participantOne:(1242840-1248160): Oh. yeah, like you know everybody wants that that left he's got the bow tie on he's. participantTwo:(1248160-1251580): Got that that dance Mark [laughter]. participantOne:(1248160-1251580): Got that that dance Mark [laughter]. participantTwo:(1251580-1253100): Yeah, [laughter]. participantOne:(1251580-1253100): Yeah, [laughter]. participantOne:(1253140-1253620): You know. participantTwo:(1253140-1253620): You know. participantOne:(1253660-1257520): Yeah, he but, but the years yeah, <unk>. participantTwo:(1253740-1257520): Yeah, he but the years <unk>. participantOne:(1257850-1262650): Yeah, so if you look at the close up from you know, 2430 for those years. participantTwo:(1257850-1262650): Yeah, so if you look at the close up from you know, 2430 for those years. participantTwo:(1262650-1268550): Are that there's a spot on the they're exactly the same and then you look at the years in the morgue? participantOne:(1262650-1268530): Are that there's a spot on the they're exactly the same and then you look at the years in the morgue? participantTwo:(1268590-1270790): Uh in 1934. participantOne:(1268610-1270790): Uh in 1934. participantTwo:(1270850-1273570): And actually the the red lines that are on there. participantOne:(1270850-1273570): And actually the the red lines that are on there. participantTwo:(1273570-1284180): I did those just to show how far the years actually protrude protrude from the side of the head and you can clearly see on the far right lower right. participantOne:(1273570-1284180): I did those just to show how far the years actually protrude protrude from the side of the head and you can clearly see on the far right lower right. participantTwo:(1284320-1289880): That the years just don't protrude very far from the, uh, you know from the head at all. participantOne:(1284320-1289880): That the years just don't protrude very far from the, uh, you know from the head at all. participantTwo:(1290680-1292800): What do you think when you see this? participantOne:(1290680-1292800): What do you think when you see this? participantOne:(1294070-1296650): Yeah, I I agree with Stewart I'm a. participantTwo:(1294070-1296650): Yeah, I I agree with Stewart I'm a. participantOne:(1298500-1298920): There. participantTwo:(1298500-1298920): There. participantOne:(1298920-1300100): I mean, there's a difference. participantTwo:(1298920-1300100): I mean, there's a difference. participantOne:(1301130-1303910): And in those pictures now when you do look at the pictures. participantTwo:(1301130-1303910): And in those pictures now when you do look at the pictures. participantTwo:(1303910-1304710): I mean, he sure. participantOne:(1303910-1304710): I mean, he sure. participantTwo:(1304710-1309090): Aged a lot in 10 years from 241934. participantOne:(1304710-1309090): Aged a lot in 10 years from 241934. participantTwo:(1309530-1317770): Yes, but but like Stewart says the <unk>, he aged a lot, but those years the the mouth, the nose, it did not change. participantOne:(1309610-1317770): Yes, but but like Stewart says the <unk>, he aged a lot, but those years the the mouth, the nose, it did not change. participantTwo:(1317810-1318250): Yep. participantOne:(1317810-1318250): Yep. participantTwo:(1320110-1320510): Here's. participantOne:(1320110-1320510): Here's. participantTwo:(1321790-1323150): Family rate, right. participantOne:(1321790-1323150): Family rate, right. participantTwo:(1323510-1330590): And so again, the the picture on the on the top right, you know where where the morgue photo, you know. participantOne:(1323510-1330590): And so again, the the picture on the on the top right, you know where where the morgue photo, you know. participantTwo:(1331590-1334570): Obviously we know that he's had plastic surgery. participantOne:(1331590-1334570): Obviously we know that he's had plastic surgery. participantOne:(1335290-1337990): We you know, he had actually died his hair black. participantTwo:(1335290-1337990): We you know, he had actually died his hair black. participantOne:(1338470-1344210): Um, I think the eyebrows are are trained or shaved somewhat to be a little different. participantTwo:(1338470-1344210): Um, I think the eyebrows are are trained or shaved somewhat to be a little different. participantOne:(1345830-1350030): Yeah, you know those deliver had the distinctive a cleft. participantTwo:(1345830-1350030): Yeah, you know those deliver had the distinctive a cleft. participantOne:(1350030-1352830): His chin, which actually Travis, right now as a beard. participantTwo:(1350030-1352830): His chin, which actually Travis, right now as a beard. participantOne:(1352830-1353210): You can't. participantTwo:(1352830-1353210): You can't. participantOne:(1353210-1353530): See it. participantTwo:(1353210-1353530): See it. participantTwo:(1353530-1356590): But Travis actually has that very same cleft in his <unk>. participantOne:(1353530-1356590): But Travis actually has that very same cleft in his <unk>. participantOne:(1357230-1361950): I do and and that was one of the things that the plastic surgery altered. participantTwo:(1358040-1361940): And and that was one of the things that the plastic surgery altered. participantTwo:(1361980-1365780): So you see that the course doesn't have the the cleft in the gym. participantOne:(1361990-1365750): So you see that the course doesn't have the the cleft in the gym. participantOne:(1365790-1373130): So all that was changed, but but again, it's one of those things when when I was looking at it, I just like something still doesn't look, right. participantTwo:(1365820-1373140): So all that was changed, but but again, it's one of those things when when I was looking at it, I just like something still doesn't look, right. participantOne:(1373130-1373950): What what is it? participantTwo:(1373140-1373940): What what is it? participantTwo:(1373940-1379400): That that I can't quite make this look like villager and and what for me. participantOne:(1373950-1379400): That that I can't quite make this look like builder and and what for me. participantOne:(1379400-1390080): It ended up being the years and so that like I said, this this was the start for me about about you know, okay, so what happens to years in an autopsy. participantTwo:(1379400-1390080): It ended up being the years and so that like I said, this was the start for me about about you know, okay, so what happens to years in an autopsy. participantTwo:(1390120-1405040): What happens to years when someone dies years or a you know, mainly made cartilage in the few hours from when was shot at when the autopsy was done a the the cartilage in the years? participantOne:(1390120-1401260): What happens to years when someone dies years or a you know, mainly made cartilage in a few hours from when Dillinger was shot at when the autopsy was done? participantOne:(1401940-1405040): Uh, the the cartilage in the years. participantOne:(1405080-1406940): They're, not gonna change at all. participantTwo:(1405080-1406940): They're, not gonna change at all. participantOne:(1407120-1408440): Uh, frankly they're. participantTwo:(1407120-1408440): Uh, frankly they're. participantOne:(1408440-1409960): Not gonna change one bit. participantTwo:(1408440-1409740): Not gonna change one bit. participantTwo:(1410290-1418650): Uh, they're, not gonna you know, start a decaying in any significant fashion that's gonna change the overall shape of the years. participantOne:(1410320-1417960): Uh, they're, not gonna you know, start a decaying in any significant fashion that's gonna change the overall shape. participantOne:(1417960-1418440): The years. participantTwo:(1418690-1423930): So what is it that that causes those years to pin against the head? participantOne:(1419240-1423920): So what is it that it causes those years to pin against the head? participantOne:(1424280-1429000): You know, are not protrude near like they did a villager was alive. participantTwo:(1424310-1428990): You know, or not protrude near like they did a window injure was alive. participantTwo:(1429030-1431480): And so that's, what kind of again. participantOne:(1429040-1433380): And so that's, what kind of began this thing to me where I said. participantTwo:(1431480-1434780): This thing to me where I said Holy cannoli. participantOne:(1433500-1434780): Holy cannoli. participantTwo:(1434860-1437580): Maybe there is something to this impostor. participantOne:(1434860-1437580): Maybe there is something to this impostor. participantTwo:(1437580-1438840): Theory Stewart. participantOne:(1437580-1438840): Theory Stewart. participantTwo:(1438840-1439640): I have a question. participantOne:(1438840-1439640): I have a question. participantOne:(1439680-1440480): Yes sir. participantTwo:(1439840-1443640): Yes sir, going back like the side pictures here. participantOne:(1441240-1443640): Going back like the side pictures here. participantOne:(1446330-1453610): John's years of the top and the bottom seem like they the angle towards towards the front of the head. participantTwo:(1446330-1453610): John's years of the top and the bottom seem like they the angle towards towards the front of the head. participantOne:(1453650-1454610): You know, the both do. participantTwo:(1453650-1454610): You know, the both do. participantTwo:(1456320-1457600): Now pending years. participantOne:(1456320-1458980): Now pending years will not change that right. participantTwo:(1457600-1458980): Would not change that right. participantTwo:(1459700-1463220): Not <unk>, the way they are shape for going forward. participantOne:(1459820-1460240): <unk>. participantOne:(1460240-1463220): The way they are shape for going forward. participantOne:(1463260-1464800): Well, again, I don't know, Travis. participantTwo:(1463260-1464780): Well, again, I don't know, Travis. participantTwo:(1464820-1470720): I mean, I but but again, I don't know why why why would they have Penny years. participantOne:(1464840-1470720): I mean, I but but again, I don't know why why why would they have Penny years. participantTwo:(1470760-1473260): Uh, of any way again. participantOne:(1470760-1473360): Uh, of any way again. participantOne:(1473400-1476820): So if you looked <unk>, he was self conscious about it. participantTwo:(1473590-1476670): So if you looked <unk>, he was self conscious about it. participantTwo:(1476670-1477030): Stewart. participantOne:(1476820-1477640): <unk>. participantTwo:(1477030-1482630): He wanted to finally he thought all that about is his sticky out here's that would happen. participantOne:(1478200-1482600): I know he he thought about as his sticky out here's that would happen. participantOne:(1482600-1484900): And so during the facial surgery, right. participantTwo:(1482630-1484830): And so during the facial surgery, right. participantTwo:(1485370-1486950): This is he paid them back. participantOne:(1485380-1486960): This is he paid them back. participantTwo:(1486990-1489710): I mean, <unk>, I. participantOne:(1487000-1488860): I mean, again. participantOne:(1488860-1499200): No, I know I know, you're doing that kind of a playful voice, but I actually had that thought because, uh, you know, I I'm I'm trying to figure this out anyway, I can. participantTwo:(1490630-1491650): No, I know you're doing that. participantTwo:(1491650-1498250): And kind of a playful voice, but I actually had that fault because, uh, you know, I I'm I'm trying to figure this out. participantTwo:(1498250-1498590): Anyway. participantTwo:(1498590-1499210): I can. participantTwo:(1499470-1506270): And that's that's when I found the the FBI reports of the the doctors that did this surgery. participantOne:(1499480-1506260): And that's that's when I found the the FBI reports of the the doctors that did this surgery. participantOne:(1507500-1513760): Ah, so call surgery a you know, this plastic surgery as to you know, exactly what they did. participantTwo:(1507500-1513760): Ah, so call surgery a you know, this plastic surgery as to you know, exactly what they did. participantOne:(1513760-1518740): And the FBI went into great detail about what was done in these procedures. participantTwo:(1513760-1518740): And the FBI went into great detail about what was done in these procedures. participantOne:(1518780-1526560): And nothing was mentioned about the years now they did actually there was some kind of incision that they talked about that was made in front of the years. participantTwo:(1518780-1526460): And nothing was mentioned about the years now they did actually there was some kind of incision that they talked about that was made in front of the years. participantTwo:(1526520-1534220): So I mean, you know, maybe it's possible that that the the skin, uh, when it was healing could've tightened a little bit. participantOne:(1526600-1534220): So I mean, you know, maybe it's possible that that the the skin, uh, when it was healing could've tightened a little bit. participantOne:(1534560-1542660): Uh, that, uh, would have maybe pull that here in a certain way that would be painful, but oh. absolutely. participantTwo:(1534560-1542620): Uh, that, uh, would have maybe pull that here in a certain way that would be painful, but oh. absolutely. participantOne:(1542700-1549040): But well, what Travis is pointing out here is if you, if okay, so let me let me let me again. participantTwo:(1542700-1549040): But well, what Travis is pointing out here is if you, if okay, so let me let me let me again. participantOne:(1549080-1550120): You want to go backup. participantTwo:(1549080-1550140): You want to go backup. participantOne:(1550160-1551940): You wanna leave it leave it there. participantTwo:(1550180-1551940): You wanna leave it leave it there. participantOne:(1551940-1553520): But let me let me explain what we're seeing. participantTwo:(1551940-1553520): But let me let me explain what we're seeing. participantTwo:(1554110-1559050): So again, the earlier picture we saw a villager wearing the bow tie from 1924. participantOne:(1554110-1559050): So again, the earlier picture we saw a villager wearing the bow tie from 1924. participantTwo:(1559090-1565310): This is actually the these are the side or the profile pictures of those same pictures. participantOne:(1559090-1565310): This is actually the these are the side or the profile pictures of those same pictures. participantOne:(1565310-1571350): We just saw so upper left is deliver 1924. participantTwo:(1565310-1571350): We just saw so upper left is deliver 1924. participantOne:(1571350-1575230): And then the bottom below it is a is a blow up of that picture. participantTwo:(1571350-1575230): And then the bottom below it is a is a blow up of that picture. participantTwo:(1575230-1579620): Just it's a zoomed in version in the middle, the same thing. participantOne:(1575230-1579620): Just it's a zoomed in version in the middle, the same thing. participantTwo:(1579660-1581440): Villager 1934. participantOne:(1579660-1581440): Villager 1934. participantTwo:(1581480-1587800): The one in the middle bottom is that that that zoomed in here and then the the one on the upper right. participantOne:(1581480-1587800): The one in the middle bottom is that that that zoomed in here and then the the one on the upper right. participantTwo:(1588160-1590580): And bottom is deliver in the morgue. participantOne:(1588160-1590580): And bottom is deliver in the morgue. participantOne:(1591420-1595460): Um, so if you look at the first two years on the bottom zoomed in. participantTwo:(1591420-1595460): Um, so if you look at the first two years on the bottom zoomed in. participantTwo:(1596500-1598900): Very, very similar, the shape is the same. participantOne:(1596500-1598900): Very, very similar, the shape is the same. participantOne:(1598900-1604260): The the top of the year kind of points a you know in the same direction. participantTwo:(1598900-1604260): The the top of the year kind of points a you know in the same direction. participantTwo:(1604260-1612100): It's angled a relative to the head in the same way where as if you look at it at the other the picture. participantOne:(1604260-1612100): It's angled a relative to the head in the same way where as if you look at it at the other the picture. participantOne:(1612100-1616240): Villager, the morgue that that ear actually angles back. participantTwo:(1612100-1616240): Villager, the morgue that that ear actually angles back. participantOne:(1616420-1622170): So, um, I would think if somehow there was an incision made on the face. participantTwo:(1616660-1622170): So, um, I would think if somehow there was an incision made on the face. participantTwo:(1622210-1624510): Somehow to do a face list of some kind. participantOne:(1622210-1624510): Somehow to do a face list of some kind. participantOne:(1624670-1629050): If anything, it would pull that easier more toward the the face. participantTwo:(1624670-1629050): If anything, it would pull that easier more toward the the face. participantOne:(1629050-1632230): And and it would angle more toward the front, but instead it. participantTwo:(1629050-1632230): And and it would angle more toward the front, but instead it. participantTwo:(1632230-1632990): Angles back. participantOne:(1632230-1632990): Angles back. participantOne:(1634490-1635190): Angles back. participantTwo:(1634500-1635180): Angles back. participantTwo:(1635180-1637060): We explain that to me. participantOne:(1635190-1637070): We explain that to me. participantTwo:(1637060-1637940): Okay, look look. participantOne:(1637070-1637910): Okay, look look. participantTwo:(1637980-1645680): If you look at the very top of the year and you know, I don't know if I don't know you have the if you have any kind of a. or anything, but what, I'm looking at. participantOne:(1637990-1645690): If you look at the very top of the year and I don't know if you if you don't, if you have the if you have any kind of a. or anything, but what, I'm looking at. participantTwo:(1645940-1648200): Yeah, okay, what I'm looking at right now. participantOne:(1645950-1648190): Yep, okay, what I'm looking at right now. participantOne:(1648190-1649090): Is the year that's? participantTwo:(1648200-1649100): Is the year that's? participantOne:(1649090-1652350): All the the you know of the of the body and the morgue. participantTwo:(1649100-1652360): All the the uh, you know of the of the body and the mortgage. participantTwo:(1653200-1655620): On the bottom right or yeah, or the bottom. participantOne:(1653200-1655620): On the bottom right or yeah, or the bottom. participantOne:(1655620-1658800): Yep, yep, yep and if you look at the very top of the year. participantTwo:(1655620-1658800): Yep, yep, yep and if you look at the very top of the year. participantTwo:(1658800-1664240): There's a certain, a. or a Crown ing to that ear at the very top. participantOne:(1658800-1664240): There's a certain, a. or a Crown ing to that ear at the very top. participantOne:(1664800-1674980): Um, and then the structure from there just seems to to. a up or backwards versus the other two photos. participantTwo:(1664800-1674980): Um, and then the structure from there just seems to to. a up or backwards versus the other two photos. participantOne:(1675200-1676180): Oh. I see what you mean. participantTwo:(1675200-1676180): Oh. I see what you mean. participantOne:(1676180-1688920): Yeah, like towards the back of his head, Chris is kinda like almost like an elephant here like you've got more elephant like years in on the younger pictures and and then the other one kind of goes back. participantTwo:(1676180-1688920): Yeah, like towards the back of his head, Chris is kinda like almost like an elephant here like you've got more elephant like years in on the younger pictures and and then the other one kind of goes back. participantOne:(1688980-1690280): I see what you mean by back now. participantTwo:(1688980-1690280): I see what you mean by back now. participantTwo:(1690420-1692340): Okay, and obviously folks we're. participantOne:(1690420-1692340): Okay, and obviously folks we're. participantOne:(1692340-1693500): Sorry, [laughter]. participantTwo:(1692340-1693500): Sorry, [laughter]. participantOne:(1693560-1700060): If you're listening to this and we're just talking about like random year shapes and stuff like we understand follow us on you too. participantTwo:(1693580-1700060): If you're listening to this and we're just talking about like random year shapes and stuff like we understand follow us on you too. participantTwo:(1700060-1709480): We'll, put some stuff on tick tock and Facebook, but um, also we're, gonna give you the opportunity to see this report and download it for yourself, but well, we'll get to that later. participantOne:(1700060-1709480): We'll, put some stuff on tick tock and Facebook, but um, also we're, gonna give you the opportunity to see this report and download it for yourself, but well, we'll get to that later. participantOne:(1709520-1714840): So shape very clearly elephant ear not elephant ear. participantTwo:(1709520-1714840): So shape very clearly elephant ear not elephant ear. participantOne:(1714980-1715680): Absolutely. participantTwo:(1715020-1715680): Absolutely. participantTwo:(1715680-1726360): So, it's very different a very different from you know, we like, I said, if you compare it with with photographs taken 10 years apart that look very very similar. participantOne:(1715680-1726360): So, it's very different a very different from you know, we like, I said, if you compare it with with photographs taken 10 years apart that look very very similar. participantOne:(1726440-1736810): Okay, uh, you know versus the one that was taken roughly six months after the, um, the one in the middle, the the middle picture. participantTwo:(1726440-1736810): Okay, uh, you know versus the one that was taken roughly six months after the, um, the one in the middle, the the middle picture. participantTwo:(1736810-1738190): And the picture to the right. participantOne:(1736810-1738190): And the the picture to the right. participantOne:(1738190-1743970): Were taken roughly six months apart and the year is just drastically shaped differently. participantTwo:(1738190-1743970): Were taken roughly six months apart and the year is just drastically shaped differently. participantOne:(1745540-1749940): I it wouldn't be difficult to. participantTwo:(1745540-1749940): I it wouldn't be difficult to. participantTwo:(1751380-1751860): Fixed. participantOne:(1751410-1751870): Fixed. participantTwo:(1751860-1755600): Like because we see how the there's similarities in the face stuff. participantOne:(1751870-1755550): Like because we see how the there's similarities in the face stuff. participantTwo:(1755740-1763080): Maybe I'm getting a little too deep here a head of myself, but like the eyebrows like we talked about the cleft, the chin stuff like that. participantOne:(1755750-1763070): Maybe I'm getting a little too deep here a head of myself, but like the eyebrows like we talked about the cleft, the chin stuff like that. participantOne:(1763110-1781090): Yeah, could it possibly be changed like could you could could they after the fact make the impostor look more like John versus us trying to figure out if John, if that's, John on the table? participantTwo:(1763120-1781090): Yeah, could it possibly be changed like could you could could they after the fact make the impostor look more like John versus us trying to figure out if John, if that's, John on the table? participantOne:(1781090-1782550): Do you know where I'm going with this? participantTwo:(1781090-1782550): Do you know where I'm going with this? participantTwo:(1782630-1792530): I I yes, I I've been like I say, yes, I've been through the same process in my mind and actually, I I I I think Todd has is probably read this. participantOne:(1782630-1792530): I I yes, I I've been like I say, yes, I've been through the same process in my mind and actually, I I I I think Todd has is probably read this. participantOne:(1792570-1793450): Uh, this stuff. participantTwo:(1792570-1793450): Uh, this stuff. participantTwo:(1793450-1794950): That's the background of this stuff. participantOne:(1793450-1794950): That's the background of this stuff. participantTwo:(1795090-1807460): The most more recently than any of us, but the doctors and I use that phrase very loosely in this contacts, but the doctors that actually did this plastic surgery. participantOne:(1795090-1807460): The most more recently than any of us, but the doctors and I use that phrase very loosely in this contacts, but the doctors that actually did this plastic surgery. participantTwo:(1807920-1818750): Um, I I think one was a known alcoholic, uh, the other one was like a you know, a a a serial a felon in and out of jail. participantOne:(1807920-1818750): Um, I I think one was a known alcoholic, uh, the other one was like a you know, a a a serial of felons in and out of jail. participantTwo:(1819350-1822850): Um, you know, I think to do what. participantOne:(1819350-1822850): Um, you know, I think to do what. participantTwo:(1822850-1823850): You're talking about Joe. participantOne:(1822850-1823850): You're talking about Joe. participantTwo:(1823850-1829330): Would have taken you know, very skilled surgeons plastic surgeons to to do this kind of thing. participantOne:(1823850-1829330): Would have taken you know, very skilled surgeons plastic surgeons to to do this kind of thing. participantTwo:(1829850-1850090): Um, and these guys, I think barely had the skill to you know, drink a glass of whiskey, a and and you know, obviously they you know, this was this was delivered and his body were trying to you know, high from the lawyer, this is why they had these these procedures done. participantOne:(1829850-1850090): Um, and these guys, I think barely had the skill to you know, drink a glass of whiskey, a and and you know, obviously they you know, this was this was delivered and his body were trying to you know, high from the lawyer, this is why they had these these procedures done. participantOne:(1850130-1856010): So the doctors that they found that would actually do this we're really not the most reputable guys. participantTwo:(1850130-1856010): So the doctors that they found that would actually do this we're really not the most reputable guys. participantOne:(1856010-1860050): So they're, obviously, not the most qualified to do what needed to be done. participantTwo:(1856010-1860050): So they're, obviously, not the most qualified to do what needed to be done. participantTwo:(1860050-1864010): So I don't think anything related to changing the shape of the years. participantOne:(1860050-1864010): So I don't think anything related to changing the shape of the years. participantOne:(1864050-1873130): Would have I think that would've been way beyond the skill level of an alcoholic and Anna serial fellow I I bring up. participantTwo:(1864050-1873150): Would have I think that would've been way beyond the skill level of an alcoholic and Anna serial fellow I I bring up. participantOne:(1873170-1874910): Can you scroll down one? participantTwo:(1873190-1874890): Can you scroll down one? participantTwo:(1876770-1878290): I know, we're talking years. participantOne:(1876770-1878330): I know, we're talking years. participantOne:(1878390-1881990): This one, uh, yeah, we're <unk>. participantTwo:(1878390-1881990): This one, uh, yeah, we're <unk>. participantOne:(1882030-1883590): Go backup, go back, mhm. participantTwo:(1882030-1883590): Go backup, go back <unk>. participantOne:(1883630-1884830): Yep, right there. participantTwo:(1883630-1884830): Yep, right there. participantOne:(1885190-1888130): Okay, so you know, we've been sitting years. participantTwo:(1885190-1888130): Okay, so you know, we've been sitting years. participantOne:(1888250-1889430): I have to bring this up. participantTwo:(1888250-1889430): I have to bring this up. participantTwo:(1890600-1893260): Look at the nostrils look at the top picture. participantOne:(1890600-1893260): Look at the nostrils look at the top picture. participantTwo:(1894600-1894900): To. participantOne:(1894600-1894900): To. participantOne:(1895940-1908600): The top of that that nostril. the opening goes up the body, the suppose deliver the the nostril opening Engels down the opening goes down. participantTwo:(1895940-1908600): The top of that that nostril. the opening goes up the body, the suppose deliver the the nostril opening Engels down the opening goes down. participantTwo:(1910980-1912660): Absolutely stupid. participantOne:(1910980-1912660): Absolutely stupid. participantOne:(1912660-1915080): Just says, yep, yep, [laughter]. participantTwo:(1912660-1915080): Just says, yep, yep, [laughter]. participantTwo:(1916380-1917980): That you you make a great case. participantOne:(1916380-1917980): That you you make a great case. participantTwo:(1917980-1918720): Travis. participantOne:(1917980-1918720): Travis. participantOne:(1918760-1919280): You. participantTwo:(1918760-1922360): You I've not really looked at these pictures. participantOne:(1920660-1922360): Haven't really looked at these pictures. participantTwo:(1922360-1925280): This closely other than one other time. participantOne:(1922360-1925280): This closely other than one other time. participantOne:(1925280-1930460): I've ever got report some something else that gets me and I'm gonna play Devil's advocate pretty hard here. participantTwo:(1925280-1930460): I've ever got report some something else that gets me and I'm gonna play Devil's advocate pretty hard here. participantTwo:(1930500-1934540): So something something that gets me is that is the uh. participantOne:(1930500-1934540): So something something that gets me is that is the uh. participantTwo:(1935680-1937780): Crows peak is that what we call it. participantOne:(1935680-1937780): Crows peak is that what we call it. participantTwo:(1937820-1938840): The airline. participantOne:(1937820-1938840): The airline. participantOne:(1939020-1949580): Yeah, so like the airline is very like this thing and I don't know if this is like a piece of her that's like falling down because it it does it feels like the airline also. participantTwo:(1939060-1949580): Yeah, so like the airline is very like this thing and I don't know if this is like a piece of her that's like falling down because it it does it feels like the airline also. participantTwo:(1949840-1964870): This is a bad angle on the right hand side with the autopsy photo, but it's kind of not as prominent the windows peak that's what's called the windows peak is in its prominent on the body to the right or the left. participantOne:(1949840-1958810): This is a bad angle on the right hand side with the autopsy photo, but it's kind of not as prominent the windows peak that's. participantOne:(1958810-1964870): What it's called the windows peak is in its prominent on the body to the right or the left? participantOne:(1964870-1966890): The other thing is the side. participantTwo:(1964870-1966890): The other thing is the side. participantOne:(1966890-1972450): Burns if we go up I'm gonna go backup to the another the other photos with the side. participantTwo:(1966890-1972450): Burns if we go up I'm gonna go backup to the another the other photos with the side. participantTwo:(1972450-1972970): Burns. participantOne:(1972450-1972970): Burns. participantTwo:(1974000-1975960): And, uh, I'm, sorry. participantOne:(1974000-1975960): And, uh, I'm, sorry. participantTwo:(1977160-1978300): The side Burns this. participantOne:(1977160-1978300): The side Burns this. participantOne:(1978340-1993140): Yeah, yeah, the side Burns are, um, I know again there her cuts and all that's kind of stuff, but like the where the where the side Burns kind of end or like the the missing here pieces. participantTwo:(1978340-1993140): Yeah, yeah, the side Burns are, um, I know again there her cuts and all that's kind of stuff, but like the where the where the side Burns kind of end or like the the missing here pieces. participantOne:(1993260-1994860): You guys have to look at the pictures. participantTwo:(1993340-1994860): You guys have to look at the pictures. participantTwo:(1994900-1995200): That's. participantOne:(1994900-1995200): That's. participantTwo:(1995200-1997220): What comes down to if you're listening to podcasts? participantOne:(1995200-1997220): What comes down to if you're listening to podcasts? participantOne:(1998100-2002060): But that's the discrepancy too I'm just kinda like that looks a little different. participantTwo:(1998110-1999730): But that's a discrepancy too I'm. participantTwo:(1999730-2001990): Just kinda like that looks a little different. participantTwo:(2002030-2006370): Yeah also you know, a again, Devil's advocate. participantOne:(2002100-2006360): Yeah also you know, a again, Devil's advocate. participantOne:(2006360-2011060): You could say that the windows peak, uh, that that's easily solved. participantTwo:(2006370-2011070): You could say that the windows peak, uh, that that's easily solved. participantOne:(2011100-2015740): You know, he could just take a razor and just cut a you know, it's hard line. participantTwo:(2011110-2025810): You know, he could just take a razor and just cut a you know, it's airline straight across and you know a also the autopsy report is very specific that the scalp here was a medium Brown color. participantOne:(2015740-2018500): Straight across and you know. participantOne:(2019520-2025780): Also the autopsy report is very specific that the scalp here was a medium Brown color. participantOne:(2025980-2028820): That in the rest of the air was died black. participantTwo:(2026010-2028890): That in the rest of the air was died black. participantOne:(2028860-2034800): So I mean, he whoever was on the autopsy table was clearly trying to. participantTwo:(2028930-2034770): So I mean, he whoever was on the autopsy table was clearly trying to. participantOne:(2034840-2041530): Uh, you know, disguise his identity, which to me hits that this is this was delivered. participantTwo:(2034850-2041530): Uh, you know, disguise his identity, which to me hits that this is this was delivered. participantOne:(2042250-2048410): Okay, yeah, and if this is the body that they're talking about right here again, we now we have to explain. participantTwo:(2042250-2048410): Okay, yeah, and if this is the body that they're talking about right here again, we now we have to explain. participantOne:(2048410-2050030): Well, okay, I can understand you. participantTwo:(2048410-2050030): Well, okay, I can understand you. participantTwo:(2050030-2052890): Can you can save that windows peak you can cut it? participantOne:(2050030-2052910): Can you can save that windows peak you can cut it? participantOne:(2053290-2058050): Uh, the side Burns you can easily change, but how do you change those years? participantTwo:(2053290-2058050): Uh, the side Burns you can easily change, but how do you change those years? participantTwo:(2058050-2060530): How you explain those years, huh? participantOne:(2058050-2060530): How you explain those years, huh? participantTwo:(2060530-2061410): And that's that's. participantOne:(2060530-2061410): And that's that's. participantTwo:(2061410-2066230): What I have wrestled with I've come back with over and over Joe what's? participantOne:(2061410-2066230): What I have wrestled with I've come back with over and over Joe what's? participantOne:(2066230-2067870): The other the other thought about this. participantTwo:(2066230-2067870): The other the other thought about this. participantOne:(2067870-2073170): Yeah, it could be John trying to hide his identity or it could be somebody else trying to look like John. participantTwo:(2067870-2073210): Yeah, it could be John trying to hide his identity or it could be somebody else trying to look like John. participantOne:(2073290-2075030): Yes, yes, right. participantTwo:(2073290-2075030): Yes, yes, right. participantOne:(2075030-2076850): Because he's dying you're <unk>, the black. participantTwo:(2075030-2076850): Because he's dying you're <unk>, the black. participantTwo:(2078430-2079150): I don't know, it's. participantOne:(2078430-2079150): I don't know, it's. participantTwo:(2079150-2080010): Just questions. participantOne:(2079150-2080010): Just questions. participantOne:(2080050-2081990): We're just asking questions. participantTwo:(2080050-2081990): We're just asking questions. participantOne:(2082030-2082710): That's that's. participantTwo:(2082030-2082710): That's that's. participantOne:(2082710-2091230): All this is about and again, this is why I say if I had been the case agent assigned to this these are all the kind of questions. participantTwo:(2082710-2091230): All this is about and again, this is why I say if I had been the case agent assigned to this these are all the kind of questions. participantOne:(2091270-2095630): I would want answered and I would not close this case until I had these answers. participantTwo:(2091270-2095630): I would want answered and I would not close this case until I had these answers. participantTwo:(2097800-2099340): What definitive? participantOne:(2097800-2099320): What definitive? participantTwo:(2100200-2102600): Answers did you get have you gone out to anybody. participantOne:(2100200-2102600): Answers did you get have you gone out to anybody. participantTwo:(2102600-2108960): Stewart and asked anybody like an ear experts or pathologist or somebody to get kind of their take on this. participantOne:(2102600-2108960): Stewart and asked anybody like an ear experts or pathologist or somebody to get kind of their take on this. participantOne:(2108960-2111960): Have you talked to anybody outside of the research that you did? participantTwo:(2108960-2111960): Have you talked to anybody outside of the research that you did? participantOne:(2112000-2117260): So, um, as Todd knows I'm a very a avid tennis player. participantTwo:(2112040-2117260): So, um, as Todd knows I'm a very a avid tennis player. participantTwo:(2117260-2123560): I play a lot of tennis and in the course of playing tennis a several of my regular tennis bodies, are doctors. participantOne:(2117260-2123560): I play a lot of tennis and in the course of playing tennis a several of my regular tennis buddies are doctors. participantOne:(2124120-2127220): Uh, you know, one is <unk>. participantTwo:(2124120-2127220): Uh, you know, one is <unk>. participantOne:(2127260-2132200): Yeah, one's a radiologist one was it is a emergency room. participantTwo:(2127260-2132200): Yeah, one's a radiologist one was it is a emergency room. participantOne:(2132200-2134760): Doctor a and several others. participantTwo:(2132200-2134760): Doctor a and several others. participantTwo:(2134800-2142620): So you know, I I bought them a time and time again probably to where they don't even want me asking anymore. participantOne:(2134800-2142620): So you know, I I bought them a time and time again probably to where they don't even want me asking anymore. participantOne:(2143110-2148870): Uh, and I'm showing these photos and tried to explain you know, basically what I'm seeing in these years. participantTwo:(2143110-2148870): Uh, and I'm showing these photos and tried to explain you know, basically what I'm seeing in these years. participantOne:(2148870-2156510): Why don't these years match is this something that is a you know that the autopsy could drastically change? participantTwo:(2148870-2156510): Why don't these years match is this something that is a you know that the autopsy could drastically change? participantTwo:(2156510-2165990): Is there a you know could the plastic surgery drastically change this and the answer I'm getting back is know that there is there as baffled as I am about what? participantOne:(2156510-2165990): Is there a you know could the plastic surgery drastically change this and the answer I'm getting back is know that there is there as baffled as I am about what? participantTwo:(2165990-2166690): I'm seeing here. participantOne:(2165990-2166690): I'm seeing here. participantTwo:(2166690-2168910): What you know what we're presenting on the screen? participantOne:(2166690-2168910): What you know what we're presenting on the screen? participantTwo:(2172270-2176710): I'm stopped on this and this is the first one we've got we've. participantOne:(2172270-2176710): I'm stopped on this and this is the first one we've got we've. participantTwo:(2176710-2185490): Got a couple other ones that are really interesting, but we we also, I mean, our thought is to bring experts on the show. participantOne:(2176710-2185370): Got a couple other ones that are really interesting, but we we also, I mean, our thought is to bring experts on the show. participantTwo:(2185790-2188830): Absolutely, yes again if they're. participantOne:(2185830-2188830): Absolutely, yes again if they're. participantTwo:(2188830-2190830): Hey, if there's a logical answer to this. participantOne:(2188830-2190830): Hey, if there's a logical answer to this. participantOne:(2190870-2191630): I want it. participantTwo:(2190870-2192430): I want it <unk>. participantOne:(2192430-2206890): I want I want to know because like I said a lot of these things you know, there's there's specific little things on the airline and the the shape of the nose and and you know the overall shape of the face that to me says, Hey, that's <unk>. participantTwo:(2192430-2206910): I wanna I wanna know because like I said a lot of these things you know, there's there's specific little things on the airline and the the shape of the nose and and you know the overall shape of the face that to me says, Hey, that's <unk>. participantOne:(2206890-2207890): If I look at that and go. participantTwo:(2206910-2207890): If I look at that and go. participantTwo:(2207890-2216730): Hey, that's him you got him the the you know, case closed, but when you really hone in on the the light tiny little details. participantOne:(2207890-2216970): Hey, that's him you got him the the you know, case closed, but when you really hone in on the the light tiny little details. participantOne:(2217030-2222990): That's, where this this really starts getting funky and I I really start questioning things. participantTwo:(2217120-2222640): That's, where this this really starts getting funky and I I really start questioning things. participantTwo:(2223040-2223760): There's there's. participantOne:(2223070-2223790): There's there's. participantTwo:(2223760-2226960): This thought in my mind about, um, let's. participantOne:(2223790-2225790): This thought in my mind about. participantOne:(2226570-2226930): Let's. participantOne:(2226970-2230670): Try in my mind travel back to 1934. participantTwo:(2227000-2230680): Try in my mind travel back to 1934. participantOne:(2230850-2241150): And let's let's think about this and obviously the time period of the publicity that John got and everything that was going on at the time people. participantTwo:(2230860-2243980): And let's let's think about this and obviously the time period of the publicity that John got and everything that was going on at the time people would have taken this autopsy I'm talking about a. participantOne:(2241150-2241930): Would've taken. participantOne:(2241930-2243970): This autopsy I'm talking about a. participantOne:(2245000-2251840): FBI agents, but also the the person doing the autopsy, they would have taken this very seriously, this isn't just something. participantTwo:(2245000-2251840): FBI agents, but also the the person doing the autopsy, they would have taken this very seriously, this isn't just something. participantOne:(2252240-2256020): Oh. and here's another criminal we gotta we gotta do this quick and get some pictures and stuff. participantTwo:(2252240-2256020): Oh. and here's another criminal we gotta we gotta do this quick and get some pictures and stuff. participantTwo:(2256060-2258300): They were probably like this is very serious. participantOne:(2256060-2258300): They were probably like this is very serious. participantOne:(2258300-2264220): We need to like up our game tonight and make sure that we're doing everything to to code. participantTwo:(2258300-2264220): We need to like up our game tonight and make sure that we're doing everything to to code. participantTwo:(2264220-2269660): And to, but we're the codes and procedures and the things as strict. participantOne:(2264220-2269440): And to, but we're the codes and procedures and the things as strict. participantOne:(2270420-2274100): About documenting this stuff or was it kinda like lax days, local. participantTwo:(2270430-2274110): About documenting this stuff or was it kinda like lax days, local. participantOne:(2274100-2284080): Because in my mind 1930 for so long ago like a it was everybody was just like you know, Gonce lingers and and you know, riding horses and just that it doesn't matter as much right. participantTwo:(2274110-2284090): Because in my mind 1930 for so long ago like a it was everybody was just like you know, gone slingers and and you know, riding horses and just that it doesn't matter as much right. participantOne:(2284120-2287260): Yeah, no, yeah, so I I know exactly where you're going. participantTwo:(2284130-2287250): Yeah, no, yeah, so I I know exactly where you're going. participantTwo:(2287290-2290190): Um, so in 1934. participantOne:(2287300-2290180): Um, so in 1934. participantTwo:(2290650-2291130): . participantOne:(2290680-2291120): . participantTwo:(2293180-2301720): Yeah, it was still someone of the old of of the while S but but they had also, they were somewhat had moved into the model world. participantOne:(2293180-2301720): Yeah, it was still someone of the old of of the while S but but they had also, they were somewhat had moved into the model world. participantTwo:(2302260-2311600): Um, there's a lot of documentation about the delivery case and, uh, you know the Bureau documented alot of this stuff. participantOne:(2302260-2311600): Um, there's a lot of documentation about the delivery case and, uh, you know the Bureau documented alot of this stuff. participantTwo:(2311640-2313560): So,. participantOne:(2311700-2313560): So,. participantOne:(2315320-2320900): The the the cutting edge technology in those days for identification of who. participantTwo:(2315320-2320900): The the the cutting edge technology in those days for identification of who. participantTwo:(2320900-2332160): This body was would've been fingerprints and the one of the things that the Bureau at least I I know when I went into the FBI in 1987. participantOne:(2320900-2332160): This body was would've been fingerprints and the one of the things that the Bureau at least I I know when I went into the FBI in 1987. participantTwo:(2332480-2345410): You know, the the the the thing that the Bureau prides itself on is how well, it documents everything you know that that you know, if we go out and do something you know, we document this to the hell's a so that there's. participantOne:(2332500-2345410): You know, the the the the thing that the Bureau prides itself on is how well, it documents everything you know that that you know, if we go out and do something you know, we document this to the hell's a so that there's. participantTwo:(2345410-2347970): No question about what happened then you know, it's. participantOne:(2345410-2347970): No question about what happened then you know, it's. participantTwo:(2347970-2349130): All recorded. participantOne:(2347970-2349130): All recorded. participantTwo:(2349170-2350730): So, um, what's. participantOne:(2349170-2350730): So, um, what's. participantTwo:(2350730-2355990): Interesting about this is that the the the API for 90 years now. participantOne:(2350730-2355990): Interesting about this is that the the the API for 90 years now. participantOne:(2355990-2357350): It said you know, we got billing. participantTwo:(2355990-2357350): It said you know, we got billing. participantTwo:(2357350-2360510): Sure we got dialing sure based on the fingerprints it's, the fingerprint. participantOne:(2357350-2360510): Sure we got dialing sure based on the fingerprints it's, the fingerprint. participantOne:(2360510-2363450): So it was a positive identification through the fingerprints. participantTwo:(2360510-2363450): So it was a positive identification through the fingerprints. participantOne:(2364520-2370020): And I can't find any documentation anywhere in the FBI file. participantTwo:(2364520-2370020): And I can't find any documentation anywhere in the FBI file. participantOne:(2370060-2385520): That says the name of the agent or the examiner who actually looked at the the the dead man's fingerprints versus the original the you know, the the known fingerprints villager and said, oh. that's a match and here are the matches. participantTwo:(2370060-2385520): That says the name of the agent or the examiner who actually looked at the the the dead man's fingerprints versus the original the you know, the the known fingerprints villager and said, oh. that's a match and here are the matches. participantOne:(2386090-2396730): I have never found that document a that would show you know which highlights the things that that they found it says, oh. without a doubt that's deliver because they. participantTwo:(2386090-2396730): I have never found that document a that would show you know which highlights the things that that they found it says, oh. without a doubt that's deliver because they. participantOne:(2397770-2407880): Just rejected and you just can't see a no, the only thing rejected in the villager file or the names of of informants that they would have talked to back in the day. participantTwo:(2397770-2407880): Just rejected and you just can't see a no, the only thing rejected in the villager file or the names of of informants that they would have talked to back in the day. participantTwo:(2408040-2410460): Everything else is wide open that file. participantOne:(2408040-2410460): Everything else is wide open that file. participantOne:(2410500-2417460): So, so why isn't there something in there saying I as fingerprint examiner. participantTwo:(2410500-2417460): So, so why isn't there something in there saying I as fingerprint examiner. participantTwo:(2417460-2418120): Whoever. participantOne:(2417460-2418120): Whoever. participantOne:(2419500-2422460): Matched so many points and found this. participantTwo:(2419500-2422460): Matched so many points and found this. participantTwo:(2422460-2427280): This and this with Dillinger there's, nothing specific about how they identified. participantOne:(2422460-2427280): This and this with Dillinger there's, nothing specific about how they identified. participantOne:(2427280-2435600): They just say they did it is the corner mentioned like is the guy or the our guy who does the autopsy is he named. participantTwo:(2427280-2435600): They just say they did it is the corner mentioned like is the guy or the our guy who does the autopsy is he named. participantOne:(2436250-2437090): Oh absolutely. participantTwo:(2436250-2437090): Oh absolutely. participantTwo:(2437090-2445070): But but now you have to understand Joe that that's not the the corners job is to look at the fingerprints that's a little beyond the scope of what. participantOne:(2437090-2445070): But but now you have to understand Joe that that's not the the corners job is to look at the fingerprints that's a little beyond the scope of what. participantTwo:(2445070-2446310): He's doing sure. participantOne:(2445070-2446310): He's doing sure. participantTwo:(2446310-2448870): No, I was, I was kind of kicking back a little bit. participantOne:(2446310-2448870): No, I was, I was kind of kicking back a little bit. participantOne:(2448870-2459320): So yeah, yeah, I see what your. was about the fingerprints, but I was saying was the guy who actually did the autopsy or the corner also mentioned or was oh. <unk>. participantTwo:(2448870-2458620): So yeah, yeah, I see what your. was about the fingerprints, but I was saying was the guy who actually did the autopsy or the corner also mentioned or was it. participantTwo:(2458960-2459320): Oh. <unk>. participantTwo:(2459320-2462900): Yeah, okay, absolutely no, no there's. participantOne:(2459320-2462900): Yeah, okay, absolutely no, no there's. participantOne:(2462900-2463280): No <unk>. participantTwo:(2462900-2463280): No <unk>. participantTwo:(2463280-2467780): The autopsies documented the entire autopsy report is in the file. participantOne:(2463280-2467780): The autopsies documented the entire autopsy report is in the file. participantTwo:(2468290-2468590): It's. participantOne:(2468290-2468590): It's. participantOne:(2468630-2469410): All there. participantTwo:(2468630-2469410): All there. participantTwo:(2469750-2475130): Uh, all these kind of things are documented it's it's it's very very thorough and there's. participantOne:(2469750-2475130): Uh, all these kind of things are documented it's it's it's very very thorough and there's. participantTwo:(2475130-2478190): No blemishes on the record of the person. participantOne:(2475130-2478190): No blemishes on the record of the person. participantTwo:(2478250-2486030): If like ever before having messed up on an autopsy previously you know, we could look into no, not at all. participantOne:(2478250-2486030): If like ever before having messed up on an autopsy previously you know, we could look into no, not at all. participantTwo:(2486070-2494450): No, as far as we know the the the doctor that performed the autopsy was straight up was of reputable character. participantOne:(2486070-2494450): No, as far as we know the the the doctor that performed the autopsy was straight up was of reputable character. participantTwo:(2494510-2494770): There's. participantOne:(2494510-2494770): There's. participantOne:(2494770-2496590): No question to there's. participantTwo:(2494770-2496590): No question to there's. participantTwo:(2496590-2497710): No reason to question. participantOne:(2496590-2497710): No reason to question. participantOne:(2497750-2502490): His findings and this thing a it straight up. participantTwo:(2497750-2502490): His findings and this thing a it straight up. participantOne:(2502490-2503470): It is what it is it's. participantTwo:(2502490-2503470): It is what it is it's. participantTwo:(2503470-2504310): What he saw? participantOne:(2503470-2504310): What he saw? participantTwo:(2504350-2508770): Okay, Ah, so yeah, there's been never been any issues about that. participantOne:(2504350-2508770): Okay, Ah, so yeah, there's been never been any issues about that. participantOne:(2509450-2519350): Ah, but what I'm saying is the FBI has prided itself ever since Jager took over about how well cases are documented. participantTwo:(2509450-2519330): Ah, but what I'm saying is the FBI has prided itself ever since Jager took over about how well cases are documented. participantTwo:(2519330-2528570): And and the things that we do our documented in our reports that we turned in and I I I know how thorough it was. participantOne:(2519350-2528570): And and the things that we do our documented in our reports that we turned in and I I I know how thorough it was. participantTwo:(2528570-2536090): And I know how, um, uh, the supervisor scrutinize that kinda thing when you turned in is how well, it was you know, document. participantOne:(2528570-2536090): And I know how, um, uh, the supervisor scrutinize that kinda thing when you turned in is how well, it was you know, document. participantTwo:(2536820-2541140): So the fact that that there's not specific documentation about this. participantOne:(2536820-2541140): So the fact that that there's not specific documentation about this. participantOne:(2541180-2564960): These the specific points of identification that were found in the or fingerprints and this is something else that we're gonna find in the report that I wrote up a that's gonna talk about the fingerprints that's that's a whole nother, subject we're gonna get into because I just, you know, I I know the bureaus relied on that for 90 years that the fingerprints tell the story, but I think there's more to it than that. participantTwo:(2541180-2564960): These the specific points of identification that were found in the or fingerprints and this is something else that we're gonna find in the report that I wrote up a that's gonna talk about the fingerprints that's that's a whole nother, subject we're gonna get into because I just, you know, I I know the bureaus relied on that for 90 years that the fingerprints tell the story, but I think there's more to it than that. participantOne:(2565510-2567630): We can handle the truth. participantTwo:(2565510-2567630): We can handle the truth. participantOne:(2567670-2570250): [laughter]. participantTwo:(2567670-2570250): [laughter]. participantOne:(2571130-2572130): [laughter]. participantTwo:(2571150-2572130): [laughter]. participantTwo:(2572130-2578090): The damn truth at the time of the autopsy was there any personal property that was released to family. participantOne:(2572130-2578090): The damn truth at the time of the autopsy was there any personal property that was released to family. participantOne:(2578430-2582730): Yes, yes, and actually traffic she could probably speak to that better than I can. participantTwo:(2578430-2582730): Yes, yes, and actually traffic she could probably speak to that better than I can. participantOne:(2582990-2585290): Yeah, so the shirt. participantTwo:(2583010-2586370): Yeah, so the shirt and pants. participantTwo:(2587430-2589350): Was released back to the family. participantOne:(2587430-2589350): Was released back to the family. participantOne:(2589430-2591990): Um, back in the seventies. participantTwo:(2589430-2591970): Um, back in the seventies. participantTwo:(2591970-2599910): My grandmother took the bloody bullet written shirt out of the truck and went to backyard and burned it. participantOne:(2591990-2599910): My grandmother took the bloody bullet written shirt out of the truck and went to backyard and burned it. participantOne:(2600590-2605930): Um, because she was cleaning out the attic it came across it. participantTwo:(2600590-2605930): Um, because she was cleaning out the attic it came across it. participantTwo:(2605970-2610080): You know, again, this is a sister not an outsider. participantOne:(2605970-2610080): You know, again, this is a sister not an outsider. participantTwo:(2610120-2612740): So this brought back a lot of bad. participantOne:(2610120-2612740): So this brought back a lot of bad. participantOne:(2612740-2613420): Memories. participantTwo:(2612740-2613420): Memories. participantOne:(2613540-2617800): So yeah, we did have the articles of an outage. participantTwo:(2613540-2617800): So yeah, we did have the articles of an outage. participantOne:(2617800-2619860): We gave the pants. participantTwo:(2617800-2619860): We gave the pants. participantOne:(2620000-2622460): Um, that Stewart tested. participantTwo:(2620000-2622460): Um, that Stewart tested. participantOne:(2622840-2625700): Um, to the dilemma museum in National, Indiana. participantTwo:(2622840-2625700): Um, to the dilemma museum in National, Indiana. participantOne:(2626740-2629560): So yeah, we we had all the articles. participantTwo:(2626740-2629560): So yeah, we we had all the articles. participantTwo:(2629560-2629660): <unk>. participantOne:(2629560-2629660): <unk>. participantOne:(2629660-2639680): I think we even had the heart at one time, but it didn't get passed down and it was somebody had, but but there was no wallet or anything like that. participantTwo:(2629660-2639680): I think we even had the heart at one time, but it didn't get passed down and it was somebody had, but but there was no wallet or anything like that. participantTwo:(2640020-2643200): No, the what the report was. participantOne:(2640020-2643200): No, the what the report was. participantOne:(2643440-2643960): Which I think. participantTwo:(2643440-2643960): Which I think. participantOne:(2643960-2644440): It's odd. participantTwo:(2643960-2644440): It's odd. participantOne:(2644480-2649860): That he had a little change or like a little purse that was inside the pants. participantTwo:(2644480-2649860): That he had a little change or like a little purse that was inside the pants. participantTwo:(2650460-2652940): Um, he didn't like Carol had a wallet on him. participantOne:(2650460-2652940): Um, he didn't like Carol had a wallet on him. participantOne:(2652980-2658870): So he had money inside like a a little chain not like a change personal Stewart. participantTwo:(2653000-2658870): So he had money inside like a a little chain not like a change personal Stewart. participantOne:(2658870-2660110): You know what I'm talking about. participantTwo:(2658870-2660110): You know what I'm talking about. participantOne:(2660150-2663410): Yeah, you had a $7 and 70 cents on. participantTwo:(2660150-2663410): Yeah, you had a $7 and 70 cents on. participantTwo:(2663630-2674470): Yeah, and if you're taking a you're going to the movies with, um, your date and John was very you know, flashy draft. participantOne:(2663630-2674470): Yeah, and if you're taking a you're going to the movies with, um, your date and John was very you know, flashy draft. participantOne:(2674470-2677950): Well, he would have had a lot of money on him at the time. participantTwo:(2674470-2677950): Well, he would have had a lot of money on him at the time. participantOne:(2677990-2686340): Yeah, you think you carry around wads of cash like that like just yeah, you know about this is the days before ATMs. participantTwo:(2677990-2686240): Yeah, you think you carry around wads of cash like that like just yeah, you know about this is the days before A T M. participantTwo:(2686280-2699440): So, uh, you know, he's living with a a you know, prostitute and so you know is he necessarily gonna trust that he's gonna leave his stash of money. participantOne:(2686380-2699440): So, uh, you know, he's living with a a you know, prostitute and so you know is he necessarily gonna trust that he's gonna leave his stash of money. participantTwo:(2699480-2703440): You know where some you know where she left off somebody to come in there and get it. participantOne:(2699480-2703500): You know where some you know where she tipped off somebody to come in there and get it. participantTwo:(2703540-2706680): Yeah, now, I'm gonna I'm gonna keep that money on myself, right. participantOne:(2703540-2706680): Yeah, now, I'm gonna I'm gonna keep that money on myself, right. participantTwo:(2706740-2707940): You know, so yeah. participantOne:(2706740-2707940): You know, so yeah. participantTwo:(2709540-2713880): If you go to the movies, he like to eat and go out and. participantOne:(2709540-2713880): If you go to the movies, he like to eat and go out and. participantOne:(2714820-2715240): Girl. participantTwo:(2714820-2715240): Girl. participantOne:(2715240-2715680): So. participantTwo:(2715240-2715680): So. participantOne:(2716640-2722100): Go to the movies more than likely they went to <unk>, but everything is 10 cents $7 and 70 cents. participantTwo:(2716640-2722100): Go to the movies more than likely they went to <unk>, but everything is 10 cents $7 and 70 cents. participantTwo:(2722100-2724400): Could get it could go really far in 1930. participantOne:(2722100-2724400): Could get it could go really far in 1930. participantOne:(2724400-2725980): Yes, yeah, no, no. participantTwo:(2724400-2725980): Yes, oh yeah, no, no. participantTwo:(2725980-2733100): Question $7 went a hell of a lot further than it does now, but uh, I I agree with Travis in that that. participantOne:(2725980-2733100): Question $7 went a hell of a lot further than it does now, but uh, I I agree with Travis in that that. participantOne:(2734160-2736300): Even for 1934 standards that's. participantTwo:(2734160-2736300): Even for 1934 standards that's. participantTwo:(2736300-2736560): Uh, that's. participantOne:(2736300-2736560): Uh, that's. participantOne:(2736560-2739380): The paltry amount of money that he would have had on himself. participantTwo:(2736560-2739380): The paltry amount of money that he would have had on himself. participantOne:(2740500-2742540): Oh yeah, so that's what was found. participantTwo:(2740500-2742540): Oh yeah, so that's what was found. participantOne:(2742540-2743980): So what else was found on them. participantTwo:(2742540-2743980): So what else was found on them. participantTwo:(2745230-2749070): Um, trying to think the right. participantOne:(2745230-2749070): Um, trying to think the right. participantTwo:(2749670-2754510): Yeah, the Deringer was on him, but they didn't list it didn't. participantOne:(2749730-2753670): Yeah, the Deringer was on him, but they didn't list it. participantOne:(2753990-2754510): They didn't. participantTwo:(2754510-2756670): I don't think they listed reported. participantOne:(2754510-2756670): I don't think they listed reported. participantTwo:(2757290-2774780): Well, uh, yeah, they did Travis only because, uh, you know, one of the the issues about it was I think a lot of people said that you know, the the FBI just basically executed, but there were witness accounts of deliver on the run that he reached into his right pocket. participantOne:(2757290-2774780): Well, uh, yeah, they did Travis only because, uh, you know, one of the the issues about it was I think a lot of people said that you know, the the FBI just basically executed, but there were witness accounts of deliver on the run that he reached into his right pocket. participantOne:(2775200-2776680): Um, and it was later. participantTwo:(2775240-2776680): Um, and it was later. participantOne:(2776680-2780080): Revealed that he actually had the gun in in the right pocket. participantTwo:(2776680-2780080): Revealed that he actually had the gun in in the right pocket. participantTwo:(2780630-2784650): And there's there's actually some, um, corroboration of that. participantOne:(2780630-2784650): And there's there's actually some, um, corroboration of that. participantOne:(2784690-2794710): And when we uh, examine, the pants, a to show that that, uh, you know that that he had the, you know, the gun was in is in the right pocket. participantTwo:(2784690-2794710): And when we uh, examine, the pants, a to show that that, uh, you know that that he had that you know, the gun was in is in the right pocket. participantOne:(2795230-2798150): Did I mean it was listed as the danger? participantTwo:(2795230-2798150): Did I mean it was listed as the danger? participantTwo:(2799770-2802130): From <unk>. participantOne:(2800730-2802130): From <unk>. participantOne:(2804260-2805160): I don't believe John. participantTwo:(2804260-2805160): I don't believe John. participantTwo:(2805160-2806140): Have a weapon I'm like what. participantOne:(2805160-2806140): Have a weapon I'm like what. participantOne:(2806140-2809200): You're talking about she's public number one on the run. participantTwo:(2806140-2809200): You're talking about she's public number one on the run. participantOne:(2809240-2812660): Yeah, yeah, I hear and I I honestly don't. participantTwo:(2809240-2812660): Yeah, yeah, I hear and I I honestly don't. participantTwo:(2812660-2818360): Remember that being a Deringer that was in his pocket, but but I'm I'm open to whatever it was. participantOne:(2812660-2818360): Remember that being a Deringer that was in his pocket, but but I'm I'm open to whatever it was. participantOne:(2818360-2825600): I just don't remember at the moment, but but nonetheless he had some type of a small handgun in his right pocket. participantTwo:(2818360-2825600): I just don't remember at the moment, but but nonetheless he had some type of a small handgun in his right pocket. participantTwo:(2825880-2836480): And what I believe happened and maybe I'm getting a little ahead of this on the subject, but uh, when we examine the pants there is a large bloodstain in the right pants pocket. participantOne:(2825880-2836480): And what I believe happened and maybe I'm getting a little ahead of this on the subject, but uh, when we examine the pants there is a large bloodstain in the right pants pocket. participantTwo:(2836660-2839180): And so that to me corroborates. participantOne:(2836660-2839180): And so that to me corroborates. participantOne:(2839180-2845920): What the F P I said, what some of the witnesses said that he he was reaching in that pocket and that's when the agent's decided to shoot? participantTwo:(2839180-2845920): What the F P I said, what some of the witnesses said that he he was reaching in that pocket and that's when the agent's decided to shoot? participantTwo:(2846530-2856830): Ah, because they believe that more than likely he's reaching for a weapon and so what that tells me is I know that the the fatal shot was one that entered at the base of his neck and exited, his right. participantOne:(2846530-2856830): Ah, because they believe that more than likely he's reaching for a weapon and so what that tells me is I know that the the fatal shot was one that entered at the base of his neck and exited, his right. participantTwo:(2856830-2857370): Hi. participantOne:(2856830-2857390): Hi. participantTwo:(2858190-2866300): I mean, he would've been out the lights would have gone out instantly and he hit the ground hard and when he did his hand was in that pocket. participantOne:(2858190-2866300): I mean, he would've been out the lights would have gone out instantly and he hit the ground hard and when he did his hand was in that pocket. participantOne:(2866340-2870000): I believe that that gone probably pinched. participantTwo:(2866340-2870000): I believe that that gone probably pinched. participantTwo:(2870000-2880420): His hand against the the hard pavement and you know, uh, the and caused some level of bleeding because he didn't die instantly. participantOne:(2870000-2880420): His hand against the the hard pavement and you know, uh, the and caused some level of bleeding because he didn't die instantly. participantOne:(2880420-2881460): He was still alive. participantTwo:(2880420-2881460): He was still alive. participantTwo:(2881460-2884480): When he was on the ground a very you know? participantOne:(2881460-2884480): When he was on the ground a very you know? participantTwo:(2885500-2886300): <unk>. participantOne:(2885500-2886300): <unk>. participantTwo:(2886340-2887680): Yeah, absolutely. participantOne:(2886340-2887680): Yeah, absolutely. participantOne:(2887680-2896740): I mean, he was near death, but he's still alive, which means that the heart would still have been pumping which means that if he had had an abrasion to that hand a it. participantTwo:(2887680-2896740): I mean, he was near death, but he's still alive, which means that the heart would still have been pumping which means that if he had had an abrasion to that hand a it. participantTwo:(2896740-2898400): Would've bled in that pocket and that's. participantOne:(2896740-2898400): Would've bled in that pocket and that's. participantTwo:(2898400-2899460): What explains that? participantOne:(2898400-2899460): What explains that? participantTwo:(2899460-2905720): So that that's something that a lot of people have never seen a you know that that had no, absolutely. participantOne:(2899460-2905720): So that that's something that a lot of people have never seen a you know that that had no, absolutely. participantOne:(2905720-2906680): No clue about that's. participantTwo:(2905720-2906680): No clue about that's. participantTwo:(2906680-2910020): Not described anywhere in the in the official reports. participantOne:(2906680-2910020): Not described anywhere in the in the official reports. participantOne:(2910710-2914590): So he had a pocket watch was on him exactly. participantTwo:(2910710-2914590): So he had a pocket watch was on him exactly. participantOne:(2914590-2918370): So it could've been pocket watch that could have a you know, nonetheless. participantTwo:(2914590-2918370): So it could've been pocket watch that could have a you know, nonetheless. participantOne:(2918410-2925930): I think his hand was upgraded when he hit the ground and it tells me that his hand was in that pocket was wearing a ring or anything like that. participantTwo:(2918410-2925930): I think his hand was upgraded when he hit the ground and it tells me that his hand was in that pocket was wearing a ring or anything like that. participantTwo:(2927540-2929680): No, no, no, possibly know. participantOne:(2927540-2929680): No, no, no, possibly know. participantOne:(2931040-2932440): Does he like to wear rings? participantTwo:(2931040-2932440): Does he like to wear rings? participantTwo:(2932480-2933100): Travis. participantOne:(2932480-2933100): Travis. participantTwo:(2933220-2934580): He does like to wear wings. participantOne:(2933240-2934580): He does like to wear wings. participantTwo:(2934580-2940160): I like to share this with all our reviewers who watched on you to I'm actually wearing John's ring. participantOne:(2934580-2940160): I like to share this with all our reviewers who watched on you to I'm actually wearing John's ring. participantTwo:(2940680-2950480): Um, I'll, take it off this is what he uh, was wearing at the time a little behavior laws and it was left on the nightstand and was sent back to the family. participantOne:(2940680-2950480): Um, I'll, take it off this is what he uh, was wearing at the time a little behavior laws and it was left on the nightstand and was sent back to the family. participantTwo:(2951760-2954440): I can't believe they keep sending them the family stuff. participantOne:(2951760-2954440): I can't believe they keep sending them the family stuff. participantOne:(2954480-2955780): To me. participantTwo:(2954480-2955780): To me. participantTwo:(2955780-2957140): That's that's incredible. participantOne:(2955780-2957140): That's that's incredible. participantTwo:(2957140-2959340): Like like we found this is John's here. participantOne:(2957140-2959340): Like like we found this is John's here. participantTwo:(2959340-2961380): You go like anyway. participantOne:(2959340-2961380): You go like anyway. participantTwo:(2961420-2966480): So do you think they sent it to you after or sent it to the family after he was killed? participantOne:(2961420-2966480): So do you think they sent it to you after or sent it to the family after he was killed? participantOne:(2967720-2970420): Or only it would've been sent back. participantTwo:(2967720-2970420): Or only it would've been sent back. participantOne:(2970520-2971720): I don't remember. participantTwo:(2970520-2971720): I don't remember. participantOne:(2971720-2974700): They gave the articles to his father. participantTwo:(2971720-2974700): They gave the articles to his father. participantTwo:(2974700-2976200): My great grandfather at the time. participantOne:(2974700-2976200): My great grandfather at the time. participantTwo:(2976240-2977240): He was in Chicago. participantOne:(2976240-2977240): He was in Chicago. participantOne:(2977280-2978200): Sure, sure. participantTwo:(2977280-2978200): Sure, sure. participantOne:(2978420-2982120): Well, I got 11 piece of information that I looked up. participantTwo:(2978420-2982120): Well, I got 11 piece of information that I looked up. participantTwo:(2982120-2984160): Well, and it took me a little bit here. participantOne:(2982120-2984160): Well, and it took me a little bit here. participantOne:(2984220-2993060): Um, you know, it's not Wikipedia, but it's also, not, you know, the most source thing, but according to Dave manual <unk>. participantTwo:(2984220-2993060): Um, you know, it's not Wikipedia, but it's also, not, you know, the most source thing, but a according to Dave manual <unk>. participantOne:(2993060-3000140): Com inflation raiders movie tickets movie tickets in 1933. participantTwo:(2993060-3000220): Com inflation rates remove E tickets movie tickets in 1933. participantOne:(3000760-3002140): Were like. participantTwo:(3000760-3002140): Were like. participantOne:(3003200-3007180): Six a movie ticket was $6 and 14 cents by 1937. participantTwo:(3003200-3007180): Six a movie ticket was $6 and 14 cents by 1937. participantOne:(3007280-3008400): This number has dropped. participantTwo:(3007280-3008400): This number has dropped. participantTwo:(3008400-3014480): All the way back down to $3 and 97 cents because Americans were struggling to go out. participantOne:(3008400-3014480): All the way back down to $3 and 97 cents because Americans were struggling to go out. participantTwo:(3014520-3019060): So I think I'll be shocked if that number is right that's. participantOne:(3014520-3019060): So I think I'll be shocked if that number is right that's. participantTwo:(3019060-3019760): What I'm saying? participantOne:(3019060-3019760): What I'm saying? participantOne:(3020820-3029660): $6 for a movie and but I think this I think this website is trying to to up it just for inflation that's a okay, man. participantTwo:(3020820-3029660): $6 for a movie and but I think this I think this website is trying to to up it just for inflation that's a okay, man. participantOne:(3029660-3035320): Maybe maybe maybe okay, you gotta you gotta remember the only reason why John went to the movies 1. participantTwo:(3029660-3035320): Maybe maybe maybe okay, you gotta you gotta remember the only reason why John went to the movies 1. participantTwo:(3035320-3039000): He the huge movie birth was this was in July. participantOne:(3035320-3039000): He the huge movie birth was this was in July. participantTwo:(3039040-3047620): It was a Chicago is in a very very intense heat wave and that and the bar graph heater had actual air condition and that's. participantOne:(3039040-3047620): It was a Chicago was in a very, very intense heat wave and that and the bar graph heater had actual air condition and that's. participantTwo:(3047620-3050080): Why they went there 1950? participantOne:(3047620-3050080): Why they went there 1950? participantTwo:(3050120-3052480): I I got a more reputable website. participantOne:(3050120-3052480): I I got a more reputable website. participantOne:(3052520-3053280): [laughter]. participantTwo:(3052520-3053280): [laughter]. participantOne:(3053340-3056560): It says 1950 cost of a movie tickets 40 cents. participantTwo:(3053340-3056540): It says 1950 cost of a movie tickets 40 cents. participantTwo:(3056580-3058330): So yeah, exactly. participantOne:(3056600-3058325): So yeah, exactly. participantOne:(3058365-3060825): So that sounds right. participantTwo:(3058370-3060830): So that sounds right. participantOne:(3060865-3063665): Yeah, and Travis just for our listeners. participantTwo:(3060870-3063690): Yeah, and Travis just for our listeners. participantOne:(3063705-3066205): Can you just a little trivial question? participantTwo:(3063730-3066210): Can you just a little trivial question? participantOne:(3066205-3069165): Can you name the movie that deliver saw at the bar graph? participantTwo:(3066210-3070910): Can you name the movie that deliver saw at the bar graph the Manhattan? participantOne:(3069925-3070905): Manhattan. participantOne:(3070905-3071785): Melodrama. participantTwo:(3070910-3071750): Melodrama. participantOne:(3072485-3077305): Yeah, yep, Manhattan melodrama guys we're we're, two minutes out here from the end. participantTwo:(3072490-3075630): Yeah, yep, Manhattan melodrama guys. participantTwo:(3075630-3078170): Were to minutes out here for the end of the podcast. participantOne:(3077305-3078165): The podcast. participantOne:(3078605-3080405): Thank you, everybody for listening. participantTwo:(3078710-3080310): Thank you, everybody for listening. participantOne:(3080545-3082985): This has been another treat another. participantTwo:(3080610-3082970): This has been another treat another. participantOne:(3083205-3088770): We saw a ring literally saw Travis where or ring that was John on the podcast. participantTwo:(3083250-3088730): We saw a ring literally saw Travis where or ring that was John on the podcast. participantTwo:(3088770-3099870): So this is really cool guys we're gonna keep going next episode we're gonna keep going down to the the film or report here that the steward put together. participantOne:(3088810-3099890): So this is really cool guys we're gonna keep going next episode we're gonna keep going down the the the film or report here that the steward put together. participantTwo:(3100210-3103390): Um, it'll lead to more discussions, right we're. participantOne:(3100210-3103390): Um, it'll need two more discussions, right we're. participantOne:(3103390-3106250): Just trying to get you all caught up to what. participantTwo:(3103390-3106210): Just trying to get you all caught up to what. participantTwo:(3106430-3118260): Why we think this is worth your time that we if you really think that this is something you want to help us out with please like follow subscribe and share comment? participantOne:(3106450-3118370): Why we think this is worth your time that we if you really think that this is something you want to help us out with please like follow subscribe and share comments? participantOne:(3118450-3123810): Call us email us and and really sign up for our newsletter stuff. participantTwo:(3118460-3123740): Call us email us and and really sign up for our newsletter stuff. participantTwo:(3124060-3126220): Um, there'll be opportunities for you. participantOne:(3124070-3126210): Um, there'll be opportunities for you. participantOne:(3126210-3132330): All to get involved, but our main main goal here is to continue this historical investigation. participantTwo:(3126220-3132340): All to get involved, but our main main goal here is to continue this historical investigation. participantOne:(3132330-3132710): That's, the. participantTwo:(3132340-3132700): That's, the. participantTwo:(3134160-3135640): One of history breaking. participantOne:(3134990-3137850): Breaking history, breaking. participantTwo:(3135720-3137760): Yes, history break. participantTwo:(3138380-3138960): Oh. love. participantOne:(3138390-3138970): Oh. love. participantTwo:(3138960-3141120): It any last parting words folks. participantOne:(3138970-3141110): It any last parting words folks. participantOne:(3143340-3143960): Next time. participantTwo:(3143350-3143950): Next time. participantOne:(3144000-3147620): Yep, keep digging stay tuned because we're we're staying on this thing. participantTwo:(3144010-3147610): Yep, keep digging stay tuned because we're we're staying on this thing. participantTwo:(3147610-3148450): We've been on it. participantOne:(3147620-3148440): We've been on it. participantOne:(3148440-3152340): We're staying on it meter on the bone baby it's still on it. participantTwo:(3148450-3151490): We're staying on it meet on the bone baby it's still meeting. participantOne:(3152960-3154360): Alright, everybody have a good day. participantTwo:(3152970-3154350): Alright, everybody have a good day. participantTwo:(3154390-3162330): The digging a villager pot gases produced by mobile breaks hot steam music produced by any bandits follow us on tick tock. participantOne:(3154400-3156780): The digging a villager part gas is produced by Jim. participantOne:(3156780-3158420): Hello breaks on this. participantOne:(3158460-3162300): See music produced by any bandits follow us on tick tock. participantTwo:(3162370-3166230): Facebook continue to until next time keeping. participantOne:(3162380-3165260): Facebook continue to until next time. participantOne:(3165660-3166240): Keep digging. participantTwo:(3168990-3169230): <unk>.