Bennett Maxwell (00:02.542) Jamie, what's your last name again? Buttars. B -U -T -T -A -R -S. Buttars. All right. We're good? Mm -hmm. All right. Welcome to another episode of the Deeper Than No podcast. We have Jamie Buttars on here. Yes. Welcome, Jamie. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, I'm super excited to get to know you a little more. Two hour drive, but yes, it was good. Good, good. Did you listen to any good podcasts? Get any work done? Yeah, I have a buddy who just started a podcast. OK, I started listening to some of his stuff that he started doing. That's where any of those drives I'm like, I can make this. I can learn something here. But that's also something that I'm occasionally trying to avoid that I don't need to always have to be progressing and learning something. You know, we kind of have that that tendency and drive. So, Jamie, give us a little bit of your background.

Let's see, my background, I'm 48. I just turned 48 last month. It was a struggle. I think it was bad, but I dropped out of high school my sophomore year. I'm doing my third business right now. And this one's been amazing. Been going for five years. It's a cash Coffee and more cash belly. And it's amazing. We do so much with mental health and a bunch of other things.

My mental health struggles is what got me to where I'm at now. So like I used to be very angry inside. And so I just picked up my phone, called a therapist. He actually got me in that day and it's changed my life around quite a bit. How long ago was that? About nine years ago, 10 years ago. I started seeing a therapist maybe two and a half years ago and I'm like, there's...

I don't see why anybody shouldn't. Like, it doesn't matter who you are, what you're doing, how happy you are. Like, it's for me, it was setting the target to the correct target rather than I want business, I want money, I want status, but it's like, but why do you want all that? Yeah.

Bennett Maxwell (01:50.318) Strip all that away. What emotion do you want? And can we find other ways to get that emotion? Well, a lot of people they take and they push their business or they push the gym or they push this other stuff to just bury their emotions deeper. Yeah. And then all of a sudden one day it's just going to come raging out.

but they've, you know, go to the gym, it's going to help you, it's going to do whatever, but there's nothing like finding a good therapist, sitting down and just laying it all out. When I've been open about therapy, people will reach out to me and nobody knows how to get a therapist. They're hard to get. They're so booked right now. Give it, I mean, you're, you're talking to somebody, somebody's listening. They say, okay, I want to give this a try. How do I go find a therapist? So therapists is very hard to, you know, you can get into a therapist.

Go talk to them once or twice. If you don't feel comfortable, try to get into another one. It might take you three or four months, but get into one you feel comfortable because it's pointless to keep going to see the same person if you're not gonna open up to them.

Like my therapist, my, one of my best therapists, he was in Lehigh and I'm up in Cache Valley. So I drove down once just to meet him because I had to meet him in person. Yep. You know, and I really liked him and we did zoom for over a year and then he got a different job. And how did you find him? Uh, somebody recommended him on Facebook. So people always ask me like what they're like, somebody just asked me and they live in someone in Salt Lake. I was like, I go to a guy in pleasant Grove. Like you're not going to want to drive down here. And honestly, I haven't gone in like two months because I'm going to switch.

it up. I like switching it up every so often get somebody else's point of view even though I like this guy a lot. But yeah I've given but they're like I want to go to your therapist I'm like I don't and how I found a therapist was just googling it and then talking to him and just having a meeting. That's how I found my first one. But it was scary it's like how do you find your like what? I googled him he's less than a mile from where I worked. I went and I told my boss I says hey I found me a therapist I got appointment at three o 'clock.

Bennett Maxwell (03:46.158) And he's actually the one who says, Hey, you probably need a therapist. And so he got me in that day. He had a cancellation, got me in that day. And I went to him for two years probably. And then I started a business and some other things. And then instead of being a therapist, he turned into like some kind of a business coach guy. Life coach. Yeah. Business. I'm like, I'm not here to talk about my business. I'm here to talk about my issues. Yeah. You know, like, so he was changing it, but you didn't like the change. And so then.

I went a while without a therapist and it drove me nuts. But one thing therapy taught me is how to take responsibility for my own crap. You know, when you can take responsibility for your own stuff, it's like...

It makes life so much easier. When you're constantly lying or constantly BSing your way through everything, it's just, it's hard because you can't remember what you're BSing about. Yep. And you need somebody else, kind of that third party to be like, hey, I see what you're feeling and they'll validate and accept that. But can you look at it from this other point of view? And you're just like, oh, that was there. That was obvious. How could I not see that that was me? And...

I think that therapy is great. And again, we were talking a little bit about psychedelics. I think psychedelics are great to show you all your shit that you're there. I have never really fixed it. But my therapist, my last therapist, the one that I really liked, I told him.

Different things I wanted to do like I wanted to go into one of those pods that the Indian tent things No, the pods that are completely dark and you're oh, yeah the sensor sensor deprivation. Yeah, they have one down the street here with you're in town I told my therapist I was gonna do that and he's like, are you sure? Like are you actually gonna be able to sit in with your own thoughts for 45 minutes or half an hour? I says I don't know but I'm gonna figure it out

Bennett Maxwell (05:27.63) And I went to the one we have up in Cache Valley. It wasn't what I, they have a pod, but it's not. You're like floating in saltwater. I've tried it once. You're floating in saltwater. It's pretty. Yeah. But it was, I could see light. I could see everything. I could hear what was going on. And so that's not what I was after. So like, it was a good, it was good for my muscles, got rid of my soreness, got me to relax for a minute, but it wasn't what I was after. I was kind of just like.

This is relaxing and I fell asleep and then I was like I just paid $50 for a nap in saltwater. Yeah I was very disappointed because it wasn't what I was after, you know, so and then I told him I wanted to do microdose of mushrooms. Uh -huh. And so he explained mushrooms Like you have the say you have a ski hill and you have this this spot that you can just haul butt down

And so when you get mushrooms, it's like putting a brand new thing, a snow over top. Yep. And then you got to literally read this because it deactivates the default mode network, kind of the outer layer of the brain that controls the ego. Right. So your brain is now finding different connections. Right. I have personally never done it. And I've, but I've always wanted to try it. And like he was talking about ayahuasca. I've always wanted to try that too.

They say you got to be very careful where you go to do that. It's all about set and setting because you can anyways. And the other thing that you can if you're interested in getting started with one and I just got this prescribed to me within the last two months, ketamine. So you can go to clinical settings and it's a psychedelic and it's an IV or an intramuscular shot. There's a doctor that I'm going to now and he'll prescribe it and it's a nasal spray or a trochee that goes under your tongue. And it's very short lived. You're in and out.

maybe 45 minutes, kind of like a 15 minute kind of ease into it. And then you're in it for 30, 45 minutes and then you come out. So again, ketamine that blocks your GABA receptors. So your brain to have the same thought process, it has to form new neural networks, which it's like, how's that? It's really good for you, at least in my perspective, because I can look at the same thing and it forces me neurologically to look at a different point of view, which I think is just very, very healthy. Yeah.

Bennett Maxwell (07:41.294) I've never really I mean I've heard about ketamine I know some people who do the ketamine but I've never personally looked at it for myself and like I'm around a bunch of like we we do a lot with recovering addicts alcoholics and stuff like that

And so stuff like that, like I've never really been attracted to. And the only reason I want to dry the mushrooms is just for that one time to figure out exactly who I am. Yeah. Because they say it's supposed to open up to show who you are, I guess. So that makes sense. Yes. Well, this is so the default mode network. This is my understanding of it.

You're driving here and I'm sure a lot of a big portion that drive you don't really you're not really paying attention to driving. You're just driving. That's just you're just going that's kind of that subconscious. That's what gets deactivated. So who is Jamie? Jamie is this person who lives in this house with these businesses. That shit goes away and you're just you're just consciousness. And then for me that's scary as hell because I'm like well who am I? And that's freaking like who am I supposed to be? And.

It's really scary for me. But you come out of it and you're like, oh, all that other shit doesn't really matter. Like all that stuff that I tell myself that makes up Bennett. Like that's not even true. That's just experience that happened. And I grabbed that and I said, that's who I am. And it's like, that's not who I am. Right. So it really helps you to kind of see that and separate that. So I think it's very beneficial. Ketamine was labeled as a breakthrough therapy drug for PTSD and to get

out of addictions like alcohol.

Bennett Maxwell (09:18.414) Like alcohol, meth, stuff like that. Yeah. So I don't know. Pretty, pretty cool. What I think it's really good is it breaks you open, shows you that there's stuff that needs to be fixed, which is hard without the psychedelics. It's not, it's definitely possible and do it without it. That's totally fine. But it kind of forces, but it doesn't heal you. It just breaks you open. And then that's when you integrate it with, with therapy or whatever you're doing. But just let you kind of see the person in the mirror that you're actually supposed to see. Not the one you believe is standing there. Yes. Does that make sense?

Yeah, so Adam who just left, he talked about his experience and he said, the shaman before it was administered to him, they said, this is going to be 10 years of therapy in 20 minutes. He goes, it was, it killed me. But those are the experiences that I personally had, my wife's had, our family's had because I've gotten, I mean, I'm a big proponent of it because it's helped me so much. Then I'm like, I think everybody should have this experience if they want without, you know. Yeah, we have a customer that comes in who's been going to Costa Rica.

about every six months and getting it done. And it's changed him a lot. It's some powerful stuff. Now it's not needed, right? You can have these breakthroughs without it. It's just, sometimes it's harder. Well, I think some people, they get addicted to the therapy part of the therapy. Does that make sense? Expounding on it a little bit more. So like, they - Like just being heard. The one time, so like say the guy goes and does the ayahuasca the one time and it changes his life.

So then anytime he has another hiccup down the road, he feels that he's got to go do the thing again to fix it when, you know, he truly had it in there at one point himself. He just keeps putting on somebody else here, fix my problem. Yep. Fix my problem. You know, it's like, it's an out rather than taking ownership. It's like the Oz principles. You ever read that book? The Oz principles. So what Oz? The Oz principle. Okay. No, it's, it kind of reflects life as the wizard of Oz. Okay.

You have Dorothy, you have the lion, you have the scarecrow, you have all this stuff. They gotta go to the wizard so they can get home, so they can get a brain, so they can get a heart. I can't remember exactly what all they get. But they make it all the way there, and then the wizard's like, I can't help you. You had it inside you the whole time, but too many people were so focused on everybody else fixing their problems that they don't look deep inside to do it themselves. Yeah, I listened to this meditation.

Bennett Maxwell (11:43.598) Nah, I don't know if it's a meditation. More philosophy. And like the Buddhist and the Zen teachings, it's all about like, teach me what you know, Zen master. And the answer's always, there's nothing. The answer is nothing. There is no answer. Like there's nothing there. There is no magical pill that you just gotta let go and like life is what it is.

Go with the river. Don't try to freaking control it. And what is the magic pill to fix me or to fix that? That's like a therapist. If you go to a good therapist, they hardly even talk. Yeah. They just like point you in a direction. Like asking some questions. They ask this and then they expect you to figure it out on your own. They already know the answer. They just want you to figure it out yourself because you'll heal so much faster if you figure it out on your own than if they tell you what the answer is. Yeah.

What was the, I mean, most people, like I said something about therapy on a podcast and it was a larger podcast. I was a guest and then he said, well, I've never had anybody admit to seeing therapy. And I'm like, I think that's, that's weird. I mean, it is what it is, no judgment on it, but that's why, why have you never had anybody admit, you know, and I'm kind of asking myself that question. I'm open to it because I think that it helps other people and people.

have expressed gratitude for me being open. What was it with you that made you feel comfortable saying, I see a therapist when we have the stigma? They don't do the feelings. The dude feelings. After it started changing my life, you know, after I started doing a lot better for myself, a lot better for my family and everything else. And then like the last five years that we've been doing my Coffee shop, we deal with mental health a ton.

And even before that, I'd tell people, go talk to a therapist, go talk to a therapist. Like your life will change. Was there any resistance when you first started doing that and accepting and saying, Hey, I'm a guy again that we're attaching it to our ego. Now I'm one of those guys. I'm a guy that sees a therapist. That's what I, that's what I am. Somebody says you should go see a therapist. You're like, this is bullshit. Like I don't need to see a therapist. Guys don't see therapists. They're just told to bottle it up. Cowboy up, man up, whatever, whatever you stole your whole life.

Bennett Maxwell (13:46.894) And then finally, like I just hit that point, like where something's gotta happen. Like I was just, I was angry inside. I could put on a really good front, but I was just pissed off. And at the time I coached literally football and I was like, not taking it down on the kids, but I was kind of just angry and like, oh, we're running today. You know, you guys pissed me off. We're running, you know.

And so after therapy, it just, it made me better to work with maybe, you know, a lot better coach, a lot better. But what was the click you're now you're seeing a therapist, but to be upfront and tell other people to see therapists. Like, what was there any resistance to accepting that and then, and also promoting it.

There wasn't resistance for me pushing it out, but everybody's got some resistance. Like, you know, why would I go see a therapist? Well, it helps you. Like I talk about therapy a lot. You saw the change and then you pushed it out and there wasn't really any resistance. No, let me throw this. Oh, I'm sure it's fine. But yeah, we'll edit that out. Um, okay. That's, that's awesome. Um, nine years. And then tell me why you got into mental health and how you've attached a cash Coffee with.

So I didn't get into cash Coffee for mental health, but we ended up being a safe place for people. And so why or how? How? So we got we we're very veteran and law enforcement oriented. You know, I'm very community oriented. So we have like 90 percent of our customers are veterans, law enforcement, whatever. So when they're having a bad day, they can come in and they can talk and they just hang out with people they like.

or that understand them, you know, cause most vets, like most vets and most people in general, they just want to be heard and they just want somebody to talk to and feel comfortable to talk to. And you're talking about just your Coffee shop, people coming in to have open conversations and get off a shop. Yeah. Was that purposeful or did, is that just the environment and people started, started feeling safe to express?

Bennett Maxwell (15:47.214) what they were going through and then that kind of snow. People started just feeling okay or feeling safe to be able to just talk. And then we don't have customers, we have family. So you can walk in anytime and sit at any table and just talk to anybody. Like it doesn't matter if it's your first time in there or you've been in coming in there a hundred times, you can sit and talk to anybody that's sitting there. That's awesome. Was that a conscious?

I mean that's a culture that you're creating right an amazing culture. You don't I can't go do that at Starbucks I can't go to do that at Dutch Bros Was that a conscious decision to say this is how I want to make it where to kind of just Start happening because that's who you are. It just started happening. So We had we had a customer that he was He was an army vet and he ended up divorced and homeless

So I put him in my camp trailer for three months. He's probably the first vet that I actually helped out. And then about a year later, he brought me the bullet he was gonna use. Yeah, if I want to put him in my trailer. That's amazing story. And then one day I was sitting there making Coffee and my phone just blew up, like just ringing, ringing, ringing. So I finally answered it and it was this lady and she's like, you need to come now.

my husband, we won't say his name, my husband's not doing very well. And I'm like, like right now, because I'm busy. And she's like, yeah, right now. So I said, OK, I'll be there in a sec. Ran out, got on my truck. They live a mile and a half from my house, or from this Coffee shop. So I run down there. And she's got her backpack just clenched. Well, his backpack. So his wife of his whole world. And they got in a fight. And she says, I'm done. You got to go. So he grabbed his gun, threw it in his backpack. And he's like, hey, I'm leaving. Like, I'm leaving.

So he left and luckily she got his backpack away from him. With the gun in it. And they live like a block away from the river. And he was gonna walk down there and that was it. He was a Navy vet, 10 years. Plus he was a raging alcoholic also. And so I got the backpack away and when I got there he was just shaking, just violently shaking. And finally got the gun and talked.

Bennett Maxwell (17:54.894) uh, got away from him, put him in my truck, locked it in my truck.

Talked to him and actually leaving getting in my truck. So we got my truck. We drove around for about an hour and I'm trying to think what the hell am I going to do with this guy? Like everywhere I called they're like bring him in tomorrow. Bring him in tomorrow. I'm like he's not going to make it till tomorrow. Yeah. So I just ended up calling some other vets that I know and we all went down the store. We all just sat and talked to him for about three hours. He ended up staying with one of the vets for two or three days and he's doing really good. Now he's he we got him into a therapist. He started taking some medications. He doesn't drink anymore.

And this was a few years ago. That's awesome. And so we actually have a gun safe. So Liberty Safe's got us a gun safe. Well, we had a gun safe before, but Liberty Safe's got us a bigger gun safe. They're in your Coffee shop. So we actually store people's weapons when they don't feel comfortable. We have free gun locks for people who need them. That's awesome. And so, yeah, it was pretty crazy. It was...

We've had a few of those moments. So when this guy's wife called you, had you gone through an experience similar to that in the past, talking to somebody that was on the edge? Not that close. But you rose to the occasion, you just showed up. You didn't know what you were going to do? No. You're just like, I'm going to figure this shit out. Yeah, you have to. You care about people, even though you don't really know them. Uh -huh. You know, you've been.

served him Coffee once or twice. So I have an Army Ranger buddy, he's awesome too, and I've met him by serving him Coffee. So one day, so for the last four years I've worked another job besides my Coffee shop. So I was sitting at work and I got a message and it says, hey, can you talk? I said, well, of course.

Bennett Maxwell (19:43.086) And so I called him because he hadn't called me. And when you get a message like that, it's a little different. And so I got talking to him, and he had some issues with his wife. And so I just talked to him for about 45 minutes. I'm like, you can't call your family about this because they're going to pick sides. This is like.

Her family hears her side, your family hears your side, and they just hate each other. You gotta have somebody in the middle. And I'm like, this is what you gotta do. Let's talk about this, let's go through this. And kind of related it to my relationship, you know that I'm in now. And was on the phone for about 45 minutes, and so about three months later he come in and he says, he says, I have killed people. I have watched my best friends die. But you is on the worst day of my life. And you didn't even know me.

And so it's pretty cool. Super powerful. It's me. Text me on my way here. Oh really? Yeah. How long ago is that? The first instance was about a year ago. Okay. And he's in, uh, he's in Hawaii now. So, so talk to me about kind of pivoting, uh, join fulfillment and those moments compared to joint fulfillment that you're getting, or you think you're going to get from business. Like,

I'm sure that's so different. I'd love to love to hear the two sides of the coin there the joy and the fulfillment of helping people compared to the joy and fulfillment of business Yeah, because we think you know, we I shouldn't say we I think I'm gonna start this business and you know everything's gonna be great and I can help some people and Yada yada yada and a lot of it isn't that deep and then you hear a story like you just shared and it's like Coffee shop when there's moments like these that can be had well, so my goal has changed since I originally

opened. And so we have a nonprofit for mental health and so when I expand my Coffee shop or the bigger my Coffee shop gets, the mental health will follow. So in my eyes, the bigger I can make my company, the more people I can help. So like just with my Coffee shop last year we served 3 ,000 people for Thanksgiving with help from Dirty Dough. They actually sent a bunch of cookies too.

Bennett Maxwell (21:53.646) So with help from the community, everything we did 3 ,000 people. And when I first started, that wasn't my goal. My goal was I'm going to make some money. I'm going to help some people, like a little bit of people. And now, like the money is going to come when it comes. And what caused that goal to pivot? The, I guess, the selfishness, the selflessness. Does that make sense? Yeah.

the helping people and do. And that's really where my question was. It's like you, you have the experiences of big successes, small successes, whatever in business. And then you have these other pivotal moments like, man, I really changed somebody's, I had a big impact and you had those experiences. And then it seems like you've changed your whole business to cater to have more of those types of experiences, which again, I think, man, what, what?

What else out there is giving more joy and fulfillment than what you're sharing with us right now? I don't know what does. Maybe the ayahuasca. No, I don't think. I think that's just a key to help you realize what's important, which I think, man, you're nailing it on the head. But like growing up, growing up.

I tried to find mentors, I tried to find people to teach me some stuff and like it, I ran into the beer. I love beer. I used to love beer, I don't really drink beer now. And so I kind of dove off that direction, you know, been to jail a few times, DUIs, all sorts of crap. And then once I, and then you have all these bosses that are just dicks.

You know, you bust your ass, they treat you like shit, they treat everybody like shit. So when I started my business and then started helping people, I've kinda, I wanna pull as many people up with me. You know, the helping the people and watching change people's lives is so much better than just what's in your bank account. A thousand percent, a thousand percent. And I think whatever it takes to get to that point, that realization, whether that's...

Bennett Maxwell (23:50.254) therapy, whether that's going through the depths of hell, whether that's losing a business or divorce, like all of that is worth it once you can make that realization. And like, this is actually what's important. And then reminding yourself that that's important and then pursuing that rather than these other maybe distractions. Like my, I don't have a lot of employees because I'm not big like you are, but one day I might be.

My old lady would kill me if I was that big, but she wants to keep it smaller. Yeah. But I wish. Yeah, it sucks. Well, I mean, it's got to be it's got to have his bonuses. It has bad days. But it's like one of my employees. She's she's known me since she was 12. I never knew who she was, really. And so she's she's an amazing worker. And she.

Told me one day she's like, this is the longest I've ever had a job. And you're going to have to like kill me. I'm going to have to get a car wreck before I'm going to go anywhere. She's like, I love it. Yeah. That's so, and then my other one's my nephew. He's been there five years. He loves it. And I'm like, one of these days you're both going to have your own stores. Yeah. So, I mean, we're working on a bunch of different things to grow and get them their stores that they want. Yeah. I think, I mean, for me, I can.

relate to that and feel that a lot. Like when you're like, when an employee is loving their work and their life, and you're like, oh, I had a little impact on that. Like I helped out a little bit. That's what makes all the stress. You're like, okay, maybe it was worth it. And then when people just run into you at Walmart, like, not Walmart, so about six months ago I was...

walking out of the Maverick and literally anymore it takes me 20 minutes to get out of Maverick because everybody in Cache Valley knows me anymore. I go walking out and it's actually this shirt on the back says, we'll not comply. And I turn and walk out and the guy's like, hey, I love your shirt. I'm like, oh, thanks. I know where you can get one. And I turn around and he's like, oh, I've been in that place. And so I walked up, was talking to him. He's like, you guys saved my life. And I'm like, well, what do you mean? He's like, I was going to bring my gun to you about six, eight months ago.

Bennett Maxwell (26:03.086) But I never did, but I knew it was there. And so he got a picture and he's like, I am doing so much better. I've done this and this and this. I'm like, oh, I'll take a picture, you know, because he asked for a picture. And I says, yeah, you're not going to do anything with it. And he's all one day. One day. He's all, you guys do some amazing things. And it's pretty cool. That's awesome. The impact that you had, you didn't even know you had the impact. Because all he needed was to know that there was somebody that would help him if he needed it. And that was enough for him. That's awesome. That's awesome.

Um, other than, uh, kind of going back to the beginning, you spoke about therapy and you've been doing that for nine years. Is there any other daily, weekly, monthly, uh, habits or rituals that you do, uh, to help, I guess for you it was kind of keep the anger at bay or whatever other mental health struggles. Well,

With me, I don't really have the mental health struggles anymore. Like I battled through a lot of that shit. That's amazing. You know, yeah, you kind of have to take a head on sometimes. Yep. Like, been dealing with therapy for so long. I know so much about.

HDM or EMDR EMDR a RT. I don't know what that one is. So a RT is a little different. I actually had that done. So it can kind of it can't get rid of your trauma, but it can help rewrite the story of your trauma. So it shuts down the frontal lobe and gets the creative part of your brain to go. So anyway, I've done that to tell me what it's calling it. It's art therapy. OK, I'll look into that after. So I can message you the amazing therapist up in Logan. So.

She's awesome. So when I went to see her, she's like, what do you want to change? And I said, I don't want to change anything. She's like, then why are you here? And I said, because I want to learn about it. So I've learned so much about therapies. But me, every day, I wake up at 430. Between 4 and 430, my alarm's set at 445 and 5, but I'm always up before it.

Bennett Maxwell (27:54.702) Lately I get up, I go for a walk. Well, I'm in day nine of 75 hard now. So I get up, go for a walk. I go open my store. Well, I'll get in the shower, go to my, open my store. I open my.

Out of five years, we've opened up late one time. And so, go open the store, get everything ready. I go to the gym in the morning and then other than that, just talking to people and helping people, probably my biggest therapy. My biggest mental help helper, I guess. As a business owner, or really anybody, there's so many distractions in life. Waking up early or even staying up late, those moments that you can, that it's you, I think is huge for mental health. Right.

just being able to focus on yourself, whether it's going on a walk and or also the gym, right? Doing those things in the morning and starting your day off with, I'm gonna prioritize myself first. I think subconsciously that really sets you up for the rest of the day of like, okay, I'm taking care of myself first and now I can go help other people. Well, a couple years ago I did, so I've tried 75 hard like 10 times, you know? And last year I actually completed it. And so my boy, he's,

23, and he works nights. And so what I would do is I would walk in the morning and then the nights that he didn't work, I would wait and do my walk at night. So we could actually go for 45 minute to an hour walk and catch up. And it was really good for us to just spend time together. I think more people should spend more time with their.

their kids, their loved ones, you know? Oh, a hundred percent. I think that's was the biggest regret when, when you ask, I don't know some study, but it was not spending enough time with their loved ones. That's what people regret. Not, Oh, I wish I would have worked a little bit harder. Wish we would have had a bigger house. I wish I would have had a bigger company. Like doesn't seem like those things are coming up. So last question for you, Jamie, what is the legacy you want to leave behind and how do you want to be remembered by? So I want to leave a legacy for my kids.

Bennett Maxwell (29:55.822) and my grandkids. And I want them to be able to help more people as they get older. It's really paving the way for the future generations. Yes. Like what does Ed Millett say, you can change your family tree? Yeah. That's what I want to do. Awesome. I like that. Where do guests connect with you and with your business? So cachecoffeeandmore .com is our website. Cache Coffee on Facebook.

Cache Coffee and more on Instagram and then my personal is Jamie Buttars on Facebook and Instagram. Okay. Awesome. Well, I appreciate your time. Thanks for driving down here. It's great talking. Thanks for having me. This is this is pretty cool. I enjoy these. These are pretty fun. Yeah, it's fun. Thank you. Thanks. All right. Thanks. No, it's cool.