Bearly Articulating

Thu, Dec 01, 2022 3:34PM 54:44 SUMMARY KEYWORDS dyslexia, child, students, parent, professionals, understand, screener, speech language pathologist, assessed, great, people, words, slp, reading, educational, iep, goals, language, struggling, world

00:00 To reschedule, I just got dropped. But I will get on it. Awesome. i Right. So I will I just hit record. But I will do our intro and all of that after. And so what I'll do is just jump in and just say Hi, andwelcome and have you introduce yourself and give me kind of a little synopsis of who you areand all that good stuff. 00:28 Awesome. 00:29 And then if there's anything that you want to resave, we can do that as well. 00:36 Okay, sounds good. All right. Are you ready? Whenever you are. 00:44 Welcome, welcome. Welcome. I am thrilled to chat, and have this conversation about dyslexiatoday, and how this can support your world or how it's impacting your world and all of the goodstuff. So welcome to the show. And thank you for joining us. And I'm glad to have you. 01:07 Well, thank you, Wendy, for inviting me, it has been a great opportunity to connect with youand understand what your audience would like to learn about dyslexia. So I'm excited to share. Absolutely, can you give us a brief synopsis of how you, who you are and how you got into the world, andhow this is your passion?

01:30 Awesome. So my name is Jeanette robear. Formally, Jeanette Washington, and I have beenworking as a speech language pathologist, for a little over a decade, I learned about dyslexia,back in about 2011. Because my caseload at the time was full of students who had languagebased learning disorders. And I kept hearing the word being thrown out there just casually, like dyslexia. And I was like, What is dyslexia? This was not something that I formally learned ingraduate school. So I took it upon myself to start doing more of a an analysis of thisterminology, where it derived from, what are the symptoms of it? Is this something that'sprevalent to my students? Is this something that is well known throughout the district, I mean,and obviously, as you can imagine, I went down a rabbit hole. And lo and behold, when I came out on the other side, I decided that I needed to get certified in some different evidence basedpractices, and really take what I've learned from my independent research, and propel thattowards some type of educational certification. So that is what brought me into the world ofbecause again, I had a very large caseload, and my babies were really struggling in thelanguage department. So that was my passion, trying to look at ways in which I could helpthem to fulfill their potential. And, yeah, it brought me here, and I've been working in this space for quite some time. Since then, I've earned certifications and the Forward program, the projectRead program, and the letters early childhood program, and I've even written a book aboutdyslexia. So it's brought me a mighty long way. 03:47 Well, thank you, and we're gonna talk about your book, towards the end, for sure. Can you justhelp me elaborate on? So I've had guests talk about dyslexia, but you're coming from a speechpathology lens. So can you help me help our listeners understand the role of speech pathologyas it relates to students with language based disabilities? Or specifically dyslexia? Yeah, so 04:19 it's funny you ask that because a lot of times within school districts, they don't know who iscapable or who is credible when it comes to diagnosing. Okay, so educational diagnosticians,neuropsychologist, educational psychologist, developmental pediatricians, and behavioralpediatricians, and speech language pathologist are qualified professionals to assess fordyslexia because of our extensive clinical training that we've received. So when you ask aboutour role So, we have a big role initially, as we are getting students getting learners in the doorso that they can start beginning to first get that label which opens the door to lots ofaccommodations, and support through their academic journey. 05:23 C th hldhi id tif ith dI' ti Lt' d tif dliC

Can you then help dhimmis demystify is the word I'm trying. Let's demystify, dyslexia. Can yougive us like your different definition from your experience and kind of what does dyslexia trulymean? Okay, 05:44 so dyslexia is definitely going to fall under the category of neurotypical because it is adifference neurologically. Now, I always say that this difference impacts your speech, yourlanguage, it impacts your writing, and it impacts your reading and spelling. So I always tap onthose pillars to let parents know and other professionals know that there are different facetsthat are impacted and affected by dyslexia. But the International Dyslexia Association oftendefines it as a specific learning disability that is neurobiological in origin. And it's characterized by difficulties with accurate and fluent word recognition. And so that's how they generally describe it. And the definition can get lengthier if you check out the ID a website. And that's where listeners who want that more in depth and thorough definition, they can find it there.And it's actually broken down in different ways, because it's so lengthy. 07:05 Can you give us kind of an example of how it's broken down? That may act, ACO? Oh, mygoodness, my language to help me out? How can parents apply some of this when they're kindof thinking about their, their child, their student? 07:29 Okay. So I will say first, when we're talking about the breakdown of the definition, it's importantto acknowledge that the first definition that Ida created was in 1994. And in 1994, they gottogether a group of professionals and decided to define Dyslexia as an insufficient phonologicalprocessing disorder. And it is categorized by single word decoding, which breaks then intoreading, writing and spelling. Now, in 2002, they went back to the drawing board, because theysaw that, yeah, this is a lot more than just those three components that we initially thought.And they added a lot more to it. Spelling, accuracy, fluency, comprehension, and vocabularyand a whole host of other things. So if a parent wants to really understand dyslexia, I think thatis a great first step in a diagnosis. If you see something than say something, if you notice thatyour child is struggling with attaining nursery rhymes, or if they are struggling with, you know,their verbal working memory, I mean, you can see these things as early as the age of three.One of the symptoms, but characteristics that you'll often see is they have a delay in theirspeech development. So once you see something as a parent, and you bring it to yourpediatrician, then those conversations can start to happen. And I would suggest checking outthe University of Michigan's dyslexia Help website, obviously, the International DyslexiaAssociation, and the British Dyslexia Association has some great insight too. So a lot of Oh, Yale has a Center for Creativity and dyslexia. And those would be organizations that I would say tokind of tap into and start doing your reading. And really begin that process of learning how you are going to be an advocate for your child. And please bear with me when the if I'm talking too much. 10 05

This is fantastic information. And we're going to link some of these in our show notes so thatparents and professionals can have access to the sites that you're referring to. Because you'reabsolutely right, it gives it a lot of information and to look over and really kind of figure out tobetter understand specifically where your child may be or the students that you work with thechildren that you work with. And so as you're giving us examples, Jeanette, that's really kind ofa broad scope, right? If we're talking about reading, we're talking about phonologicalawareness, we're talking about spelling, writing. In your experience, do students with dyslexiaoften showcase all of these? Or is it kind of this combination of more so one than another or a mixed? 10:57 That's a great question. So I will say there is a continuum. And so with that continuum, you willsee some rather than others, but I will say that, for most of the students I've worked with, therehas always been that indicator of them, not being able to really pick up rhyming words, that tome, it's always like, yep, we need to do further assessment here. If you are in class, and you'redoing nursery rhymes, and it's just not clicking with those younger students, then we know like,Hmm, something else may be happening here. But I will say some other indicators that arepretty common, our family history of reading and writing difficulties. When the child reads and then rereads, with little comprehension, when a child has difficulty putting thoughts into words,like they have the words, but they just are just struggling as it relates to stringing those wordsinto a sentence. Those are some of the most common indicators that I've seen. And I'm like, wow, yeah, let's do some more. Some more activities, to see if there's actually something herethat needs to be further intervened with. 12:26 That's a great point. And that leads me into my next question. So what are some techniques formitigating barriers to education from kind of your speech and language perspective? 12:42 Oh, so it's kind of layered. I will say, for an SLP. to suspect dyslexia, they must first expect thatthat child can be taught to read, we've seen research on implicit biases and lower expectationsthat a lot of teachers and speech language pathologist, and educators all around have when itcomes to children of color. So I will just say that what's really helpful is for teachers to beaware, for SLPs, to be aware, a lot of times we just think, Oh, little Johnny, he'll catch up, Oh,Johnny is just being spunky. He, you know, he doesn't want to do the work. But maybe littleJohnny is unable to do the work because he needs some support and getting that workaccomplished. So I think when we really look at how dyslexia can be addressed, we need tomake sure that the professionals working with these students have done identity work, theyhave dug deep and understood stood their privileges, their barriers that they may potentiallyhave, and just understanding how their thought process could implicate or not implicate astudent for disability.

I love how you word it that way. And what are so if a professional is listening and starting tothink, well, maybe I need to kind of dig a little deeper and do some identity work. And I know this really isn't totally about our conversation today, but extremely valuable, where could theylook where what could a person do to kind of start that process of becoming more aware?Because it's a really critical point that you have mentioned? 14:46 Yeah, so I would say once you are ready to really dig deep and understand how stereotypesand biases that you hold may be affecting How you're teaching and how you're learning, thenthe first thing you want to do is I want to so many ways I want to go with this because the firstthing I want to say is tap into your circle. But if everybody in your circle looks like you, or ifeverybody in your circle has similar experiences, then that just won't do. So I would say, thereare a couple of different organizations that I've worked with, especially when it comes togetting resources for diversity, equity and inclusion, I would say, to look into the educationalcollaborative. First, that is a really great program that is offering diversity, equity, inclusion andJustice Services. And, man, it's so it's so many. And I will say that I've learned of a lot moresince the pandemic, because we start to see people saying, like, you know, what, I need towork on myself, I have all of this time on my hands, I need to really sit down and figure somethings out. So I would say, check out and this this might be, this might go over a lot of people'sheads, but go on Instagram, and look into the search area and just put in D E I, or dij. And I think you'd be really surprised at how many accounts come up with people who are doing thiswork on a regular basis, and just start making, making it be known that this is the work youwant to do. And you want to connect with different organizations to make that happen. 16:52 I appreciate that little, little break in our road of conversation, for sure to give out someinformation and really kind of help improve the lives of the folks and the kids that we support.And I know I just totally put you on the spot for that. So thank you. 17:10 It's okay, because I was just thinking like, what would I do if I wanted to do more identity work?And so it was a great question because it made me start to really think about what I've done,what I want to do. And I'm thinking like, for the most part, the most information I've consumedhas really been on social media. And so once you click a button, and then click another button,and lo and behold, you then found some resources that you can use, or some people that youcan connect with and building that community, again, not being so. So caught on the peoplewho look like you talk like you have the same experiences, but really stepping outside of yourcomfort zone. 18:00 Absolutely, absolutely. Because the students that we serve, come from all different walks of

y, y , lives, backgrounds, everything. So I think that's incredibly important for us as adults andprofessionals to reflect upon as we're serving our students and serving our personal children.Yeah, to kind of wind back to our initial conversation can be yours alone, tell us if a student hasdyslexia. 18:31 I will say that behaviors can certainly be that breadcrumb trail for you as you are going throughthis journey and navigating these experiences. Because what we'll often see is children who are unable to read fluently, they are and I don't, and I want to watch my words very carefully andsay unable, I want to say they haven't learned to read fluently, yet. Those will be the kids that when they get called on, they could potentially you do have a temper tantrum, they can haveanxiety, which is a comorbidity that we see with dyslexia. And, you know, sometimes whenpeople have anxiety attacks is very overwhelming, and they start crying, or they get reallystuck in a position or an emotion and we're unable to coax them out of it. So I would saybehavior could certainly be something that you should watch out for, because it's telling yousomething, it is a form of communication. So we want to make sure we are very aware of the behaviors. I mean, I've seen kids like You know, start fighting another child just to get theattention off of them reading, like, they'll push somebody, or you know, you have the classclown, who may want to do something really silly and get the class off track and distract it,because they don't want to write, or you know, it's so many different behaviors that can helplead you to a better understanding. 20:26 I think that goes for a lot of different challenges that a kid may have, right? That behavior tellsus so much of what's going on and really kind of thinking through a, what is the root cause, youknow, that antecedent of causing that behavior? And then kind of working from there to reallydiscern what's happening? As a speech language pathologist? Are there specific tests that youwe had talked about in the very beginning about testing and evaluating students? Are therespecific test that parents can request or evaluators can use that can help identify dyslexia anda student? 21:11 Great question. Again, I will say that this is actually a long form question. So just just rock with me. So first and foremost, if you suspect that a child may have some language based learningdisorders, then the first thing you want to do is use a screener. Okay, a screener is going to be that snapshot of the child's development. And it is going to help indicate whether further evaluation is needed. So once you do that screener, and there are some some really good screeners out there. I have an evidence based screener that is online, also part which ispredictive assessment of reading. That's a great one Shaywitz dyslexia screener is also a greatone, and then Texas primary Reading Inventory. So once you get that screener in place, andyou see like, Huh, okay, maybe a little something, something happened in here, then what Iwould do is not only get the family history, but you want to get the intervention history, has theteacher intervened in any way to help support this child? Has this child seen the speechlanguage pathologist before? And if so, how long? What did they work on? What were the goals that they set out to accomplish? After getting that, obviously want to have that academichistory as well. So then you will have that complete evaluation after you get those things, thenthat will be what helps prompt you into doing actual standardized assessments. Now, I can tell you a list of those and kind of what they assess. But I think it's important to first do thatscreener to check the benchmarks, check the milestones, and really see where that child is.And if you think that further testing should be warranted, then that's when you go and grab allof that other data. A lot of times people do grab the data first, and then they do the screener,or, which I think is probably the smartest way is to do all of those simultaneously, just so youcan have them. So you're getting the intervention info, you're getting the family history, andyou're also working to screen that child, just so you'll have all of those eggs in the basket. So when it comes to assessment, you want to do oral language, you want to do vocabulary,knowledge, phonological processing, spelling and writing, rapid automatic naming, readingcomprehension, reading fluency. You also want to make sure you do decoding. So you're going to be assessing all of those different areas. Now, there are tons of tests, like the self five and the PvP ve T, and the court and the WISC v. So it can get it can get a little lengthy, a little Idon't want to say time consuming, but time consuming once you start assessing all of thosethings, but again, I think doing the screener is gonna help you weed out whether there needs tobe further assessment because you might do the screener and say, Okay, this job is, is, youknow, we'll be on their peers, or maybe we can support this child in this way. And then we'll come back to the drawing board to see if they need me or support with something else or if wecan accommodate them in another way. So sometimes those screeners can let us know if we really need to do all the extra work, or if we can just hone in on a certain skill set.

25:17 And having not kind of really then answers a question before about the continuum in terms ofwhere students are impacted, that knowledge is power, so that we can better program for ourstudents. We know we can better look at some research based interventions and accommodations gives us that information as professionals to support that student. And let me ask you, Jeanette, so we, you've mentioned language based disorders, and we've talked aboutdyslexia, how are the two? Are they the same? Are they similar? Are they not? Just as a parentlistening? How can they discern the difference? 26:04 So I will say they're very similar. We also have different learning disorders that are happeningaround the language space, like developmental language disorders, that's also one that hasbeen often mistaken for dyslexia. They have very nuanced characteristics. But I would say thatfor parents that are listening, it's just important to understand where the struggle is, you know,is the struggle comprehension? Are they are they able to read the passage, but they just can'tunderstand what that passage is, in telling, you know, just understanding those very specificdetails, and your child's struggle is going to be what makes the difference? 27:03 Let's talk about the CO occurrence again, what can look like? Because we talked about the COoccurrence with other neuro diversities, and then how, how does that play out for each student.

27:16 So we did talk about anxiety and dyslexia very briefly, those co occur frequently. There's also the CO occurrence of ADHD and dyslexia. And from what statistics show, it's a little over 40% of those that have been diagnosed with dyslexia also have an ADHD diagnosis. So I've even seen research on dyslexia and autism. But the prevalence was not very high. So I think in the world we live in, we definitely have to be prepared for the different occurrences and how they willshow up. So for instance, my son is intellectually gifted, but he is also he also has an anxiety disorder. So he is what they call twice exceptional. So I just think that is the age of, you know,the time we're in, nobody is just going to just have the one thing that they're struggling witheverybody is, is doubling up, for lack of better words. So, I mean, that's just from what I'vebeen seeing it, I don't even know, it'd be great to see how research plays out after thepandemic, if that has been what has caused so much anxiety amongst children, or just so muchan easiness or so much ADHD, because we're seeing and let me just take this back. Real quick.But what we're seeing I think, as parents that you know, when we drop our kids off, and theyjust like are out of our care out of our hair. I think the pandemic help to see like who these keys are. Yeah. 29:20 Yeah, it's a lot happiness. So maybe that teacher isn't telling you that little Johnny was swingingfrom the rafters because she was able to handle it and maintain it and get them down. But you're able to see now that you've spent some time with them, doing the homeschool, likeJohnny is cool. Yeah, my energy. 29:44 As a parent, you're starting to see this stuff, right? You're saying oh, well, Danny. All right. What could the parent do or what should the parent do to address the school with their concerns? 30:00 Good question. So I often think that the parents should talk to the pediatricians first. That's what I often think in my mind. And maybe that's because I work in, you know, that, that spaceas an SLP, where you're working between the medical setting and then between theeducational setting. But um, I would say talking to the pediatrician first would be helpfulbecause you have one professional onboard. Now, you know, you have that ally already. And then when you approach the school, you can say, this is what the pediatrician and I havenoticed, these are some things that we would potentially like assessed, I just feel like when youcome with that type of receipt sort of speak, then educators take it a little bit more seriously,the district tends to look at it more intently when you have another professional who is almostlike CO signed. But if you don't go directly to the pediatrician and you go to the teacher, youcan start with just a letter, because that letter gets the ball rolling. This is what I've noticed with little Johnny, I'm not sure if this is something you've noticed, but I'd like to get him assessed, Ilike to have them assessed and go from there. And you can be more specific about what you'd like them assessed for. Sometimes as parents who don't know, like the terminology or terminology or the jargon that the educators use, you can just make it very specific. I would like to see whether tea has a reading disability, I would like to see if there is a language issue orcomplication happening, you know, things of that nature.

31:57 How does the law, our law ide a apply to that letter, and that is a great nugget, to share withfamilies in terms of put it in writing, and be as good as you can in that letter. 32:14 So Id EA is very beneficial when it comes to children with potential disabilities. For those who are listening, that is the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act. And it's a law that makes available appropriate public education to eligible children with disabilities throughout the nationand ensures special education and related services to those children. So I DEA is extremely essential, especially when it comes to those with dyslexia. But what we're often seeing is thatindividuals with dyslexia fall into that category of getting a 504 plan. So the 504 plan is goingto ensure that that child has accommodations, it is the section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act, which began in 1973. And it's frequently applied in cases where students may not be providedwith an IEP, because an IEP is sometimes won't say sometimes I will say frequently, childrenwho are diagnosed with dyslexia do not fall under that individualized education program, theytend to fall into the 504, which specifies that those children get accommodations.Accommodations could be something simple as the child is able to get their lesson writtendown by the teacher or typed by the teacher. And she orally presents it to them, that they can use audio books and classes. Or that they can record the lecture for the day so they can comeback and listen to it and spend more time trying to comprehend what is do. 34:15 So if a child qualifies for a 504, that will give them the accommodations or if they qualify for anIEP. Where does that IEP team fit in for a student with dyslexia like writing goals for thestudents? What could that look like for a student identified as having a language baseddisorder? 34:43 So I have seen goals that are a lot different from what I'm used to. I think goals now are neurodiversity affirming. So what that means is that the goals like to highlight the strengths ofthe child and continue to establish baselines based on what they're really good at. I think when I was working back in the public school sector, a lot of the goals that I saw would be you know,that this child can do X, Y, and Z three times, and that will be their indicative of mastery. But now things are looking a lot different. I haven't seen any IEPs for individuals with dyslexia. So I haven't seen any goals but um, language based goals could look like you know, the child is ableto produce a preposition and the sentence correctly, or the child will be able to write theirproper nouns effortlessly and a paragraph, just things like that, that showcase that that child ismaking progress.

36:06 What could a parent ask for at an IEP table that maybe they wouldn't know that they could askfor that would really be a game changer for that student. 36:18 So that is going to be subjective. But what I would say is what I've found with almost nearly allof my dyslexic students is that they enjoy audibles, they enjoy being able to listen, rather thanread because they are spending less time and less effort trying to decode and encode differentwords. And listening helps them comprehend seamlessly. I also have seen graphic organizers being used effectively. And I think that individuals with dyslexia need more time, more timewith assessments, primarily because they are taking a little longer to process that TEKS. 37:16 And from that SLP lens, how would you contribute to that IEP? So if a parent came in and theysee an SLP, speak to and language pathologist as part of their IEP team, kind of what wouldyour role look like? 37:34 So when SLP would discuss the language goals, that are the language goals that are at stake,or that are at the table, like maybe it's a language goal about directions or increasingvocabulary, those types of things would be what that SLP can bring to the table, as far ashaving dialogue with other professionals and having exchanges with parents about goals,verbal prompts, core vocabulary words, and things like that. 38:21 So let's go back for a second, you had mentioned that the medical and the educational model.And so that can become confusing for both parents and professionals in terms of the medicalmodel tends to be different than an educational model. And so in your experience as a speechlanguage pathologist, how does that differ? Just to give insight for folks that are listening? 38:53 Well, dyslexia is not a medical diagnosis. So I am primarily speaking from the fact that I've worked across different settings. And sometimes I have to take one hat off and put the other hat on. So when it comes to distinguishing the two, for parents, I will say it's often helpful foryou to get the pediatricians opinion, because the pediatrician is going to be the one that canrefer you out to that educational, I'm sorry, that behavioral pediatrician, they can refer you outto that educational psychologist that works within their network. They can refer you out to individuals who are working within that medical slash educational scope. So that's why it's important to get their opinion as well. But either you get their opinion or you just go straightinto your school and work directly with them. Either way as fuck. I've just always been of theThe opinion that, you know, when I am going to my my child's school, I want to have somebackup. So I want to have that that letter or that note from that other person I talked to beforecame to tell them that there was an issue. And it's all about the paper trail, you know, essentially,

40:20 amen. It really is, isn't it? Yes, 40:23 you know. And the sooner you start a paper trail and understanding and acknowledging it, thebetter you'll be when it comes to advocating for your child or organizing meetings, or evengetting the paperwork ready. When you're sitting down with the SLP. When you're sitting downwith the educational diagnostician, or the neuropsychologist, you're able to say, Hey, this iswhat was provided to me. This is what this professional has already signed off on. So 40:59 what? How do we collect data on dyslexia? So if I'm in school, and I'm a, either a specialeducator, and a school or an general educator, how can I go about collecting data for thisstudent? 41:19 So on my TPT, store, I actually have like a checklist. And I would say, looking at those key,those key domains, if you have a student with dyslexia, so for instance, knowing whether theyhave issues with phonological processing, and when you're giving them an activity or activitythat involves phonological processing, and you see that they're struggling with that, makingnote of that, knowing that reading comprehension is a big component of dyslexia. And when you are reading together, what are those experiences, like making a note of that? So I wouldsay using like a little checklist, as you go, that would include that word recognition, decoding,even rhyming would help to understand as you are painting that full picture? 42:19 Could a parent use that checklist? Like if a parent wants to come to school with data, kind ofbackup, their concern? Would that relate? Or do you have another treasurer? 42:32 Gt? It' th AdIthi k Ibli th tif t t th h l dth

Get? It's the same one. And I think so I believe that if a parent comes to the school, and theyshow this checklist and say, Hey, I found difficulties in each of these areas, these areas areusually synonymous with dyslexia characteristics. So I would like to have my child assessed. 42:58 What are some ways that you have seen successful partnerships formed between an SLP in theschool team, a parent in the school team, kind of what are some success stories that you havefound as seen better outcomes? 43:19 Okay, so I would say when everybody takes away their, their personal, maybe issues with withthem with their colleagues, and they focus all of their attention on trying to see this child attheir full potential. I think there are a lot of egos when it comes to IEP meetings, people are self important. And they come to the table. And then they want to brag about all the credentialsthey have or the experience they've put in. But I think at the end of the day, when everybody iswilling to put all of that behind, so that they can look forward to assisting this student. That's what makes the partnership go smoothly, because now they're looking from the lens ofsupport, and not necessarily the lens of, you know, these different characteristics that appearwhen we get in a room full of other professionals. And then, you know, there's a lot of things about just leave it there. There's a lot of things. People feel like you can I can do this. You can't say it's a lot sometimes. But I think when we put that behind us and say, Okay, let's focus onthis child, and what we can all do collectively to help them reach their full potential. So maybe just setting the tone at the beginning of the meeting. Okay. I'm taking, taking my armor off, and I'm putting it to the side. I am meeting with you all so that we can all be on the same page.This is the same fight we're fighting, not each other. 45:14 That's right. That's right. And it's not always easy to do that I have seen in, in meetings forpeople, but I really think if we have that service, lean, and we lean into that, like we're here toserve this child so that they can be the best version of themselves and create that atmosphereof trust. That table is I think there's times where either parents or professionals come in, likeyou said, with that armor and that defensiveness, so to be able to form that relationship priorto coming to the table, and setting that sound can really be helpful. 45:55 And I like what you said about trust. That is, that is very vital, it's very vital, you know, that Ican trust you to make sure that the evidence you're providing is substantial. And we can trust each other to do our due diligence to make sure that this child reaches their, their full potential,or as you say they bring you said something so eloquently. I can't remember how you said it. But it wasn't bringing their full selves to the table. It's something.

Right, exactly, we'll have to rewind it. 46:41 But thank you for that. 46:42 Can you you drop that you have a book? Let's talk about it. Tell me about your book. 46:48 Oh, sure. brag about myself, why won't I do it? 2019, I wrote a book about how Dyslexicindividuals can be an asset to the tech sector. And within this book, it's called technical difficulties. Why dyslexic narratives matter in tech, it talks about how Dyslexics are veryempathetic, and how they can use that as well as their natural gifts, like, you know, thinkingoutside of the box and episodic memory, to really create innovative technology that we'venever seen before. So as I stated about, you know, being around people that look like us andhave similar experiences, we see that a lot in the corporate tech sector, were all of theemployees that a company all look alike, they probably have very similar cars. And you know,so it's nice when that's disrupted by someone who has a different way of thinking, someonewho has that natural neuro divergence, and they come in, and they can provide insight in avery empathetic way, and a very dynamic way. And so that's what the book is all about. It's a really great book, if I say so myself. And I just really spent time interviewing individuals who'veworked in tech who have dyslexia and talking to them about their experiences, and just put itout into the world. So I'm happy about it. And I hope that more people are able to benefit from its content. I've had some great reviews. And I think it's only up from here. So I'm hopeful that maybe I'll do a second edition, go downloads? 48:48 Can you give us some low hanging fruit in terms of how a student could start to create theirpathway to that technology field? Oh, 49:01 great question. So I would say I'm paying? That's a really good question. So if that child is interested in tech, I would say that they should narrow down what part of tech they want to bein. Because as you can imagine, everything is really tech focused. Now. The medical fields are tech focus now. Just anything you can name, even education and just so many sectors aroundus are tech enabled. So just understanding exactly what it is. They are passionate about whatthey want to bring to the world, create for the world and start looking up free courses andclasses in that area. Because this is the age of society where everything can be found on your favorite search engine. So there are free classes on different platforms that help kind of honethose skill sets in, that you are passionate about, I would say kind of understanding how theywant to change the world. And from there, it's very simple to find courses that are free on all ofour favorite course sites, and kind of just dive in deeper into that work. Because sometimes what they'll find is, you know, I thought I was passionate about that, but I'm not quite patient.And that's good, too, because it's getting you closer to where your passions lie. So startingearly, is my low hanging fruit start early, even if that child is 13, or 12, or whatever, startprobing them to see how they want to change the world. And as a parent, you can also useyour favorite search engine, they don't have to, you know, as frequently you can look and seewhat is going on. They have STEM programs everywhere.

51:09 I have a smile on my face. I am a mom of three boys. And so when I hear Tech, I automaticallythink of like video gamers and programming in that space. But I love and appreciate that you talk about the medical space and the educational space. So there's a lot of different avenues one could go into 51:34 agriculture, like goodness, yeah. So I think that is 51:39 just tremendous within itself to have that with your child. And to start it with, how are yougoing to change the world? I'm going to have that conversation tonight. 51:56 They're gonna be looking at you like, huh, but this starting question, though, gets theconversation going. And, you know, hopefully, you'll see those lightbulbs pop at the top of their heads. Because that excitement is going to be what drives them towards their passion. 52:15 That's right. That's right. As we wrap up, and I love this, and I will link your book and our shownotes so that folks can take a read and open up some more ideas and have bigger light bulbmoments with that. And so I appreciate that in for you sharing with us. If you are my finalquestion, if you had one tip for parents to place on a billboard, what would it be? And why? 52:46 Wow, you got me right there. I would say one tip to place on a billboard would be don't forget to show your child love. You know, sometimes we get so caught up in dealing with the stressors f tth di i k th tf th thth lit of assessments, the diagnosis process, we know the costs from the teacher, the complaintsfrom the school, our own work that we're doing, whether it is external or interior work thatwe're working through, that we we don't get to love on our kids. We don't show them how much we really appreciate them being in this world. And I think that we have to do more of that, you know, show them love. Let them know that we are their allies. You know, we're we're fighting this fight. We're going through these things. We are we're right here with you like side by side. And I think that's how children end up having difficulties as adults with childhood trauma. Oh my gosh, because you know, their parent was so busy fighting the fight that theynever stopped to just say, Hey, I love you. And I'm here for you. So that's what I would say.

54:11 And that's how we build a better community. 54:13 Agreed. Great. 54:16 Wow. Thank you so much for this tremendous and credible dialogue and just adding yourapproach and your practice, to the conversation and threading and some really fabulous tipsfor everybody that's listening. So I really appreciate your time. 54:38 You are very welcome. 54:41 Thank you